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Have you played around with an equalizer (hardware or software, doesn't matter) that offers rather extreme adjustments like +15dB or more, to see if you can app

Have you played around with an equalizer (hardware or software, doesn't matter) that offers rather extreme adjustments like +15dB or more, to see if you can approximate a flat source+ear system? Or is your loss more like a brickwall filter than a 12dB/octave slope for example? I'm an audio engineer, not an audiologist, so I'm just shooting from the hip here as it's something I've been curious about in case I develop a similar issue as I age.

ddingus 5y ago
Another thing they could try would be a different eq curve overall. I always find The Sound of Music as reproduced on older narrow band with am radios and phonographs interesting. A lot of that gear doesn't really produce anything over 10 khz. But, where they emphasized frequencies in the spectrum is different from Modern equipment, which basically is shooting for flat response. My grandfather's old radio, when played in a room have a comfortable volume, sounds really good. It's present. And even when I use the little transmitter to send it an idealized signal, it had a roll off starting around 8khz, the absolute high-end was maybe 12khz. I never took the time to analyze it in detail, and kind of wish I had. The usual 62-100 hurts emphasis, like what you'll find on your typical loudness button on a 70's or 80's stereo was there. But it also shaped the sound in 3 to 8khz range. The end result was a very natural sound the didn't overpower, felt like it should be there in the room with all the other sounds. Wish I could say more but I'm not where I have any detail information. I can say the enjoyment of the music is different, and fulfilling. It's not bright, like those higher frequencies bring to the overall feel of the program being produced. Robust, full, seem descriptive... clear is another one. Often, when I hear high bandwidth audio, through limited devices, it seems muddy, unclear, not precise. Those older radios are not like that. Well, the better ones anyway. In any case, the eq is different, and that impacts our perception related to the overall feel of the sound. Sorry for the typos. I'm doing this with the voice dictation. I may actually go back and revisit this myself. As I age up I'm getting be expected, natural roll off most all of us get in our later years.
- wrycoder 5y ago
  I think one of the reasons for vinyl’s reputation is that it’s often played on old sound systems. Ones with real bass and treble controls!
  - ddingus 5y ago
    Yeah I think that is true. However I was really speaking to something a little older than that, though vinyl could still be a source signal for it. You go back far enough, and the gear starts to roll off about 10 khz, yet if you listen to a modern signal through it, it sounds good. That's what I'm getting at.
biggieshellz 5y ago
Please don't do this. This would work for a conductive hearing loss (ear drum or bones in your ear messed up, etc.) but not for a sensorineural hearing loss (like what you get from aging or from noise exposure). You need non-linear compression to compensate for loudness recruitment. At a basic level, when you have sensorineural hearing loss, soft sounds will sound way softer than they should (or be below the threshold of audibility), but loud sounds will sound about the same as they should. If you crank up the volume for the affected frequency bands to make it sound right for soft sounds, then with loud transients, it will sound way too loud, and potentially do more damage to your hearing. Look at https://positive-feedback.com/Issue66/hearing.htm https://positive-feedback.com/Issue66/hearing.htm if you want to hack something together that will work better and not damage your hearing.
- wrycoder 5y ago
  Quite right! I’m quite “deaf” in the sense that I can’t understand what people are saying - they sound muffled (and I can’t separate two people talking at once anymore). But, I’m actually quite sensitive to loud noises! What I need is equalization and compression, so I can hear the soft noises. I don’t need much, if any, overall gain. Why can’t Apple provide that, they have all the necessary technology at hand?
  - hunter2_ 5y ago
    Do hearing aids offer this sort of multiband compression? I've heard about hearing aids that act as Bluetooth headphones, so presumably your Apple device could send its unaltered audio over Bluetooth and then the hearing aid's custom programming could handle things from there?
    - biggieshellz 5y ago
      Yes, they do (in fact, they have custom hardware to do it), but the power budget is very, very small, so there have to be tradeoffs made, both in terms of the processing and in terms of the actual transducer.

ddingus 5y ago

Another thing they could try would be a different eq curve overall. I always find The Sound of Music as reproduced on older narrow band with am radios and phonographs interesting. A lot of that gear doesn't really produce anything over 10 khz. But, where they emphasized frequencies in the spectrum is different from Modern equipment, which basically is shooting for flat response. My grandfather's old radio, when played in a room have a comfortable volume, sounds really good. It's present. And even when I use the little transmitter to send it an idealized signal, it had a roll off starting around 8khz, the absolute high-end was maybe 12khz. I never took the time to analyze it in detail, and kind of wish I had. The usual 62-100 hurts emphasis, like what you'll find on your typical loudness button on a 70's or 80's stereo was there. But it also shaped the sound in 3 to 8khz range. The end result was a very natural sound the didn't overpower, felt like it should be there in the room with all the other sounds. Wish I could say more but I'm not where I have any detail information. I can say the enjoyment of the music is different, and fulfilling. It's not bright, like those higher frequencies bring to the overall feel of the program being produced. Robust, full, seem descriptive... clear is another one. Often, when I hear high bandwidth audio, through limited devices, it seems muddy, unclear, not precise. Those older radios are not like that. Well, the better ones anyway. In any case, the eq is different, and that impacts our perception related to the overall feel of the sound. Sorry for the typos. I'm doing this with the voice dictation. I may actually go back and revisit this myself. As I age up I'm getting be expected, natural roll off most all of us get in our later years.

wrycoder 5y ago
I think one of the reasons for vinyl’s reputation is that it’s often played on old sound systems. Ones with real bass and treble controls!
- ddingus 5y ago
  Yeah I think that is true. However I was really speaking to something a little older than that, though vinyl could still be a source signal for it. You go back far enough, and the gear starts to roll off about 10 khz, yet if you listen to a modern signal through it, it sounds good. That's what I'm getting at.

biggieshellz 5y ago

Please don't do this. This would work for a conductive hearing loss (ear drum or bones in your ear messed up, etc.) but not for a sensorineural hearing loss (like what you get from aging or from noise exposure). You need non-linear compression to compensate for loudness recruitment. At a basic level, when you have sensorineural hearing loss, soft sounds will sound way softer than they should (or be below the threshold of audibility), but loud sounds will sound about the same as they should. If you crank up the volume for the affected frequency bands to make it sound right for soft sounds, then with loud transients, it will sound way too loud, and potentially do more damage to your hearing. Look at https://positive-feedback.com/Issue66/hearing.htm https://positive-feedback.com/Issue66/hearing.htm if you want to hack something together that will work better and not damage your hearing.

wrycoder 5y ago
Quite right! I’m quite “deaf” in the sense that I can’t understand what people are saying - they sound muffled (and I can’t separate two people talking at once anymore). But, I’m actually quite sensitive to loud noises! What I need is equalization and compression, so I can hear the soft noises. I don’t need much, if any, overall gain. Why can’t Apple provide that, they have all the necessary technology at hand?
- hunter2_ 5y ago
  Do hearing aids offer this sort of multiband compression? I've heard about hearing aids that act as Bluetooth headphones, so presumably your Apple device could send its unaltered audio over Bluetooth and then the hearing aid's custom programming could handle things from there?
  - biggieshellz 5y ago
    Yes, they do (in fact, they have custom hardware to do it), but the power budget is very, very small, so there have to be tradeoffs made, both in terms of the processing and in terms of the actual transducer.