4 ms·

Not related, but CA has banned gas-powered lawn equipment (mowers, weed destroyers, blowers). Sort of the "small airplane" thing first.

by smm11 5y ago

yabones 5y ago
Honestly, a way better approach is to just stop having lawns that need mowing. More people need to plant native species that actually belong there instead of a monoculture of invasive plants. And, much more importantly in some drought-prone areas, plants that need little or no irrigation.
jandrese 5y ago
I was glad CA did this, because suddenly every big box store is selling electric lawn equipment that was designed in this century. Just a few years ago I went looking for an electric lawnmower and they were still using 6v lead acid batteries for 20 minutes of runtime on a 12" blade and cost a small fortune. Two years ago suddenly everybody has affordable lithium powered modular battery systems. Granted, they're all made out of cheap plastic, but getting people actually buying them is the most important first step in getting good and affordable equipment.
rootusrootus 5y ago
While they're writing regulations about it, I wish they'd mandate a standard for rechargeable batteries for the lawn equipment. As it stands, we get proprietary standards like cordless power tools where batteries have something like 90% margins.
- cptskippy 5y ago
  > I wish they'd mandate a standard for rechargeable batteries for the lawn equipment. This has never occurred to me but that seems obvious. I wonder if it's just not something on lawmaker's radar. We know that all tool makers will scream and say "how can we be sure 3rd party batteries won't explode in our tools?" I wonder if there could be some sort of certification for both batteries and tools that would mitigate such an issue.
  - bombcar 5y ago
    They might bitch and moan but they'd take it up to force everyone to upgrade tools to "fit the new batteries". As it is if you care you can get adapters on eBay/Amazon for cheap.
    - rootusrootus 5y ago
      > As it is if you care you can get adapters on eBay/Amazon for cheap. In my experience, that's usually from one proprietary format to another (e.g. I have an adapter to use older "18V" DeWalt batteries in newer "20V" tools. But I haven't had much luck finding an adapter that would let me use 18650s in my cordless drills.
  - rootusrootus 5y ago
    > "how can we be sure 3rd party batteries won't explode in our tools?" Hopefully the response to that would just be laughter. IIRC, many of the proprietary batteries used in power tools today use commodity cells internally, either 18650s or 20650s. Not many (any?) are developing their own proprietary cells. Their secret sauce is the plastic shell and connector shape. What we need, IMO, is standardized sizes and quick-connectors for batteries that are about 10-20x the capacity of an 18650. Big enough for the kind of power a tool needs, small enough that there's not much excuse for a hand tool or lawn mower not to fit them.
    - adolph 5y ago
      > Their secret sauce is the plastic shell and connector shape. And load leveling, over/under current protection, metering UI, etc etc. Also, not all 18650s have the same characteristics for dis|charge rates, and capacity.
      - rootusrootus 5y ago
        I assume power tool manufacturers use commodity charging circuits, rather than trying to second guess with their own proprietary creation. > Also, not all 18650s have the same characteristics for dis|charge rates, and capacity. This is true, but I have one charger that handles them all. Not just 18650s, either, but bigger batteries and smaller ones too. It is a solved problem, and not something that a power tool manufacturer needs to try to solve again.
- WillPostForFood 5y ago
  I have a Greenworks leaf blower, trimmer, and chainsaw. They all take the same battery cartridge, and they sell their tools without batteries so you only have to buy one battery and swap it around as needed. There are third party battery packs that will work as well.
  - rootusrootus 5y ago
    Right, this is exactly how it works. They have you nicely locked into their ecosystem.
david422 5y ago
Got an electric mower a few years ago for a small lawn. Quiet, cordless, zero maintenance. Moved houses and got a bigger lawn. Got an electric riding mower - a big one - to make sure it could handle the lawn in 1 go. It was expensive, but again zero maintenance, no gas, oil etc, always charged and ready to go. I have been impressed so far. Next up electric car. Got solar panels to charge my electric devices. I'm aiming for the long game - hoping it'll pay off in the long run both in cost and environmental.
- moistly 5y ago
  > It was expensive Why not hire a mowing service? Also expensive, but it puts more velocity into the local economy, is much more efficient (all that lithium and plastic to be used for an hour once a week?), and frees up your valuable time.
  - david422 5y ago
    I considered it, but a couple of reasons. 1. cost - compared to the service, the mower should pay for itself in about 2 years, so everything after is saving money. 2. emissions - i want to reduce emissions and the mowing service is not on electric. Both of these have up front costs, but in the long run I think they are worth it.
Stevvo 5y ago
I'm all for that idea if only for noise abatement on lazy Saturday mornings.

Not related, but CA has banned gas-powered lawn equipment (mowers, weed destroyers, blowers). Sort of the "small airplane" thing first.

by smm11 5y ago

Not related, but CA has banned gas-powered lawn equipment (mowers, weed destroyers, blowers). Sort of the "small airplane" thing first.

yabones 5y ago

Honestly, a way better approach is to just stop having lawns that need mowing. More people need to plant native species that actually belong there instead of a monoculture of invasive plants. And, much more importantly in some drought-prone areas, plants that need little or no irrigation.

jandrese 5y ago

I was glad CA did this, because suddenly every big box store is selling electric lawn equipment that was designed in this century. Just a few years ago I went looking for an electric lawnmower and they were still using 6v lead acid batteries for 20 minutes of runtime on a 12" blade and cost a small fortune. Two years ago suddenly everybody has affordable lithium powered modular battery systems. Granted, they're all made out of cheap plastic, but getting people actually buying them is the most important first step in getting good and affordable equipment.

rootusrootus 5y ago

While they're writing regulations about it, I wish they'd mandate a standard for rechargeable batteries for the lawn equipment. As it stands, we get proprietary standards like cordless power tools where batteries have something like 90% margins.

cptskippy 5y ago
> I wish they'd mandate a standard for rechargeable batteries for the lawn equipment. This has never occurred to me but that seems obvious. I wonder if it's just not something on lawmaker's radar. We know that all tool makers will scream and say "how can we be sure 3rd party batteries won't explode in our tools?" I wonder if there could be some sort of certification for both batteries and tools that would mitigate such an issue.
- bombcar 5y ago
  They might bitch and moan but they'd take it up to force everyone to upgrade tools to "fit the new batteries". As it is if you care you can get adapters on eBay/Amazon for cheap.
  - rootusrootus 5y ago
    > As it is if you care you can get adapters on eBay/Amazon for cheap. In my experience, that's usually from one proprietary format to another (e.g. I have an adapter to use older "18V" DeWalt batteries in newer "20V" tools. But I haven't had much luck finding an adapter that would let me use 18650s in my cordless drills.
- rootusrootus 5y ago
  > "how can we be sure 3rd party batteries won't explode in our tools?" Hopefully the response to that would just be laughter. IIRC, many of the proprietary batteries used in power tools today use commodity cells internally, either 18650s or 20650s. Not many (any?) are developing their own proprietary cells. Their secret sauce is the plastic shell and connector shape. What we need, IMO, is standardized sizes and quick-connectors for batteries that are about 10-20x the capacity of an 18650. Big enough for the kind of power a tool needs, small enough that there's not much excuse for a hand tool or lawn mower not to fit them.
  - adolph 5y ago
    > Their secret sauce is the plastic shell and connector shape. And load leveling, over/under current protection, metering UI, etc etc. Also, not all 18650s have the same characteristics for dis|charge rates, and capacity.
    - rootusrootus 5y ago
      I assume power tool manufacturers use commodity charging circuits, rather than trying to second guess with their own proprietary creation. > Also, not all 18650s have the same characteristics for dis|charge rates, and capacity. This is true, but I have one charger that handles them all. Not just 18650s, either, but bigger batteries and smaller ones too. It is a solved problem, and not something that a power tool manufacturer needs to try to solve again.
WillPostForFood 5y ago
I have a Greenworks leaf blower, trimmer, and chainsaw. They all take the same battery cartridge, and they sell their tools without batteries so you only have to buy one battery and swap it around as needed. There are third party battery packs that will work as well.
- rootusrootus 5y ago
  Right, this is exactly how it works. They have you nicely locked into their ecosystem.

david422 5y ago

Got an electric mower a few years ago for a small lawn. Quiet, cordless, zero maintenance. Moved houses and got a bigger lawn. Got an electric riding mower - a big one - to make sure it could handle the lawn in 1 go. It was expensive, but again zero maintenance, no gas, oil etc, always charged and ready to go. I have been impressed so far. Next up electric car. Got solar panels to charge my electric devices. I'm aiming for the long game - hoping it'll pay off in the long run both in cost and environmental.

moistly 5y ago
> It was expensive Why not hire a mowing service? Also expensive, but it puts more velocity into the local economy, is much more efficient (all that lithium and plastic to be used for an hour once a week?), and frees up your valuable time.
- david422 5y ago
  I considered it, but a couple of reasons. 1. cost - compared to the service, the mower should pay for itself in about 2 years, so everything after is saving money. 2. emissions - i want to reduce emissions and the mowing service is not on electric. Both of these have up front costs, but in the long run I think they are worth it.

Stevvo 5y ago

I'm all for that idea if only for noise abatement on lazy Saturday mornings.