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People who call for other people's firings in organizations that they have no visibility into are so weird. This post reads like a tech outage's version of canc

by avl999 5y ago

People who call for other people's firings in organizations that they have no visibility into are so weird. This post reads like a tech outage's version of cancel culture where trying to find someone to blame and skewer for an injustice is more important than actually determining how much (if any) blame they deserve for it Also posting a LinkedIn event photos with people's real names and pictures in a top post on HN along with provocative framing like "partying in Vegas" about this outage is pretty shitty. Atlassian is a big company and has a huge engineering and sales department, you have no idea if any of those people at the Vegas event had anything to contribute with the outage response. For example in your link there are literally people talking about some new mobile app their team is launching at the event, I doubt any of those people are involved in the outage response. No one posting on HN unless they work at Atlassian in a leadership role is in any position to even start assigning blame, call for firings or publicly shaming people (the later of which you shouldn't be doing even if you 100% knew for a fact that they were at fault). Do better.

rootsudo 5y ago
I agree. Customer success is a support role, this was an engineering mistake. Can't blame support for something an engineer did.
- femiagbabiaka 5y ago
  Seems like you're still assigning blame. Incidents are rarely if ever monocausal. The fantastic and accurate point the GP made is that fingerpointing is pointless. Much better to seek to learn and understand, which is always difficult but definitely can't be done from the sidelines without speaking to those involved.
  - rootsudo 5y ago
    Which is why I used mistake, the context is blaming support for an engineering action. Support is purely reactive.
- roywashere 5y ago
  The major complaint in the article is lack of communication
- colonwqbang 5y ago
  Some people have an important role to play when other people mess up. The fire brigade aren't the ones who start fires but it's their job to try to help out when it happens. If they don't show up when your town catches fire, you would be disappointed.
x86_64Ubuntu 5y ago
How on earth did you rope cancel culture into this conversation?
- ramraj07 5y ago
  Apparently getting fired for incompetence is now cancel culture lol. Sign me up for that world for sure!
  - afiori 5y ago
    So the hypothetical UX designer for a new mobile app showed serious incompetence by allowing the infrastructure cloud team to mess up ops? whether this is cancel culture not it definitely looks like finding an easy target to shout at
    - colonwqbang 5y ago
      Nobody said that? > Atlassian's Global Head of Customer Success probably should have been fired I don't know who carries the true blame here, but calling for the resignation of a top manager isn't really unreasonable or immoral on the face of it.
DecoPerson 5y ago
The original commenter (OC) did not call for anyone to be fired. They stated an opinion; they did not make a demand. The OC is directing us to information made public by Atlassian team members themselves. The OC did not make the information public. Anyone could find that information with little effort. I’m not really sure why you attribute such intensity to the OC’s rather benign comments.
gorgoiler 5y ago
The main article is about how Atlassian have, out of nowhere, ceased business operations for 400 of their customers. They are no longer a going concern and this could happen to anyone who uses their products which is (alas) quite a lot of us. That’s my perspective. Reading your comment it feels like between the lines you don’t think this is as serious as other people. If you have a different perspective, could you come out and say it? Can you elaborate on why a “Global Head Of” isn’t a senior leader? Do you think this is an unfortunate tech outage that is to be expected from any b2b tech company of this size? If you did, I wonder how many people here would disagree with you. Implicitly, the person to whom you are responding does. “Business collapse” and “vegas party” do not look good getting caught in bed together. Your point would come across much better if it wasn’t mixed with moral outrage. If you have alternative opinions please share them and back them up. Then you will have earned a little more of the massive amount of social capital you need to tell someone, in public and quite rudely, to do better.
- AyyWS 5y ago
  Do you realize just how disconnected sales and operations are? Look at your organization chart. They connect at the CEO. My previous company lost customer data. Someone deleted a previous employee's account which surprise contained a production customer website. We didn't halt sales and outreach. I mean RSA lost all of their encryption seeds in 2011. Every account was compromised. They still do sales today.

by avl999 5y ago

rootsudo 5y ago

I agree. Customer success is a support role, this was an engineering mistake. Can't blame support for something an engineer did.

femiagbabiaka 5y ago
Seems like you're still assigning blame. Incidents are rarely if ever monocausal. The fantastic and accurate point the GP made is that fingerpointing is pointless. Much better to seek to learn and understand, which is always difficult but definitely can't be done from the sidelines without speaking to those involved.
- rootsudo 5y ago
  Which is why I used mistake, the context is blaming support for an engineering action. Support is purely reactive.
roywashere 5y ago
The major complaint in the article is lack of communication
colonwqbang 5y ago
Some people have an important role to play when other people mess up. The fire brigade aren't the ones who start fires but it's their job to try to help out when it happens. If they don't show up when your town catches fire, you would be disappointed.

x86_64Ubuntu 5y ago

How on earth did you rope cancel culture into this conversation?

ramraj07 5y ago
Apparently getting fired for incompetence is now cancel culture lol. Sign me up for that world for sure!
- afiori 5y ago
  So the hypothetical UX designer for a new mobile app showed serious incompetence by allowing the infrastructure cloud team to mess up ops? whether this is cancel culture not it definitely looks like finding an easy target to shout at
  - colonwqbang 5y ago
    Nobody said that? > Atlassian's Global Head of Customer Success probably should have been fired I don't know who carries the true blame here, but calling for the resignation of a top manager isn't really unreasonable or immoral on the face of it.

DecoPerson 5y ago

The original commenter (OC) did not call for anyone to be fired. They stated an opinion; they did not make a demand. The OC is directing us to information made public by Atlassian team members themselves. The OC did not make the information public. Anyone could find that information with little effort. I’m not really sure why you attribute such intensity to the OC’s rather benign comments.

gorgoiler 5y ago

The main article is about how Atlassian have, out of nowhere, ceased business operations for 400 of their customers. They are no longer a going concern and this could happen to anyone who uses their products which is (alas) quite a lot of us. That’s my perspective. Reading your comment it feels like between the lines you don’t think this is as serious as other people. If you have a different perspective, could you come out and say it? Can you elaborate on why a “Global Head Of” isn’t a senior leader? Do you think this is an unfortunate tech outage that is to be expected from any b2b tech company of this size? If you did, I wonder how many people here would disagree with you. Implicitly, the person to whom you are responding does. “Business collapse” and “vegas party” do not look good getting caught in bed together. Your point would come across much better if it wasn’t mixed with moral outrage. If you have alternative opinions please share them and back them up. Then you will have earned a little more of the massive amount of social capital you need to tell someone, in public and quite rudely, to do better.

AyyWS 5y ago
Do you realize just how disconnected sales and operations are? Look at your organization chart. They connect at the CEO. My previous company lost customer data. Someone deleted a previous employee's account which surprise contained a production customer website. We didn't halt sales and outreach. I mean RSA lost all of their encryption seeds in 2011. Every account was compromised. They still do sales today.