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Title is click-bait. Vehicle was not "stuck" at 83mph. Brakes and steering were operational, while car computer rebooted.

by tintor 5y ago

hammock 5y ago
That is still a big deal. See also the Toyota accelerator issue: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009%E2%80%932011_Toyota_vehicle_recalls https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009%E2%80%932011_Toyota_vehic...
- bin_bash 5y ago
  Apparently you're not very familiar with how that story turned out: https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748704422204576131311592922574 https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748704422204576131... tl;dr: we don't really know what caused it but it wasn't electronics. Malcolm Gladwell did a great piece on it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N3naJ0P0gM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N3naJ0P0gM
  - hammock 5y ago
    Why does it have to be electronics for my reference to matter? The idea is just because the brakes and steering still work doesn't mean the car is safe.
    - bin_bash 5y ago
      > The third and most common problem was drivers hitting the gas when they thought they were hitting the brake, which the NHTSA called "pedal misapplication." The problem was drivers getting the pedals mixed up. There was nothing wrong with the cars and officials blamed the drivers—hence the title of the article: "U.S. Blames Drivers, Not Toyota"
      - hammock 5y ago
        I thought “we don t really know what caused it.” Now you’re saying we do?
  - olyjohn 5y ago
    A few months after that article... NASA did some investigating and found tin whiskers in some faulty accelerator pedals. And interestingly enough, these pedals would all test out fine. This particular one the complaint noted that she had to hit the brake to get the car to stop. So she did not end up crashing. So I'm inclined to believe her car really did take off suddenly. This presentation changed up my mind a bit about unintended acceleration in these cars. https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-NASA-GSFC-whisker-failure-app-sensor.pdf https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-NAS... I do believe that it could happen, but also I do believe that in most cases you should be able to slam on the brakes and stop the car.
phendrenad2 5y ago
What about this part? "the car was stuck going 83 mph" Seems pretty clear to me.
xattt 5y ago
It seems the brakes were fighting against the motor. Also, try turning at 83 MPH.
triyambakam 5y ago
"Stuck [unable to go faster than] 83mph" is what they knew you would understand, right? (Sarcasm) So I agree it is click bait, but it does still sound dangerous to be unable to signal or accelerate on the freeway.
- throwawayboise 5y ago
  And if the signals were not working, I wonder if the brake lights were? Hopefully they are independently wired and directly switched from the brake pedal and the 12v accessory power. Slowing down on the freeway without working brake lights is also quite dangerous.
sithadmin 5y ago
Operational brakes vs 'brakes actually capable of overcoming the motor' are two entirely different things. You'll find that for many vehicles, the brakes alone will not be sufficient to stop if the motor is attempting to accelerate; you need to shift to neutral (potentially destructive), or kill the engine. Plenty of people accidentally drive around with their emergency brake engaged and don't realize it.
- throwaway0a5e 5y ago
  Pretty much every vehicle except maybe some heavy trucks with really, really, really deep first gears has brakes that can over-power everything else. This should be obvious when you think about what % of brake force it takes to break traction vs what percent of engine power it takes.
- bin_bash 5y ago
  > the brakes alone will not be sufficient to stop if the motor is attempting to accelerate Malcolm Gladwell went into detail about how this is BS on Revisionist History: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N3naJ0P0gM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N3naJ0P0gM It doesn't pass the smell test either: what car accelerates faster than it can stop?
  - tesseract 5y ago
    > It doesn't pass the smell test either: what car accelerates faster than it can stop? A dragster? But more seriously, modern high-performance electric cars (such as some Tesla models) are capable of both acceleration and braking pretty much at their tires' adhesion limit. I would still expect the mechanical braking system to be designed to be able to overcome the maximum torque of the motor although I do not know whether or not that is in fact the case.
- mywittyname 5y ago
  > You'll find that for many vehicles, the brakes alone will not be sufficient to stop if the motor is attempting to accelerate; Maybe in 60s cars with 4 wheel drums. But the brake force on even basic modern cars is sufficient to overcome like 800hp. Go ahead and give it a shot in your own car and see. I have a 400+hp car with shitty brakes and it will still stop completely and readily if I hold down the throttle and brakes at the same time in second gear. Now, if you ride the brakes, they will overheat and lose stopping power. So you're going to want to actually try to stop the car.
sshine 5y ago
If the title had been “Tesla glitched at 83mph” it would have been exactly right and not less scary sounding.

Title is click-bait. Vehicle was not "stuck" at 83mph. Brakes and steering were operational, while car computer rebooted.

by tintor 5y ago

Title is click-bait. Vehicle was not "stuck" at 83mph. Brakes and steering were operational, while car computer rebooted.

hammock 5y ago

That is still a big deal. See also the Toyota accelerator issue: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009%E2%80%932011_Toyota_vehicle_recalls https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009%E2%80%932011_Toyota_vehic...

bin_bash 5y ago
Apparently you're not very familiar with how that story turned out: https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748704422204576131311592922574 https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748704422204576131... tl;dr: we don't really know what caused it but it wasn't electronics. Malcolm Gladwell did a great piece on it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N3naJ0P0gM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N3naJ0P0gM
- hammock 5y ago
  Why does it have to be electronics for my reference to matter? The idea is just because the brakes and steering still work doesn't mean the car is safe.
  - bin_bash 5y ago
    > The third and most common problem was drivers hitting the gas when they thought they were hitting the brake, which the NHTSA called "pedal misapplication." The problem was drivers getting the pedals mixed up. There was nothing wrong with the cars and officials blamed the drivers—hence the title of the article: "U.S. Blames Drivers, Not Toyota"
    - hammock 5y ago
      I thought “we don t really know what caused it.” Now you’re saying we do?
- olyjohn 5y ago
  A few months after that article... NASA did some investigating and found tin whiskers in some faulty accelerator pedals. And interestingly enough, these pedals would all test out fine. This particular one the complaint noted that she had to hit the brake to get the car to stop. So she did not end up crashing. So I'm inclined to believe her car really did take off suddenly. This presentation changed up my mind a bit about unintended acceleration in these cars. https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-NASA-GSFC-whisker-failure-app-sensor.pdf https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-NAS... I do believe that it could happen, but also I do believe that in most cases you should be able to slam on the brakes and stop the car.

phendrenad2 5y ago

What about this part? "the car was stuck going 83 mph" Seems pretty clear to me.

xattt 5y ago

It seems the brakes were fighting against the motor. Also, try turning at 83 MPH.

triyambakam 5y ago

"Stuck [unable to go faster than] 83mph" is what they knew you would understand, right? (Sarcasm) So I agree it is click bait, but it does still sound dangerous to be unable to signal or accelerate on the freeway.

throwawayboise 5y ago
And if the signals were not working, I wonder if the brake lights were? Hopefully they are independently wired and directly switched from the brake pedal and the 12v accessory power. Slowing down on the freeway without working brake lights is also quite dangerous.

sithadmin 5y ago

Operational brakes vs 'brakes actually capable of overcoming the motor' are two entirely different things. You'll find that for many vehicles, the brakes alone will not be sufficient to stop if the motor is attempting to accelerate; you need to shift to neutral (potentially destructive), or kill the engine. Plenty of people accidentally drive around with their emergency brake engaged and don't realize it.

throwaway0a5e 5y ago
Pretty much every vehicle except maybe some heavy trucks with really, really, really deep first gears has brakes that can over-power everything else. This should be obvious when you think about what % of brake force it takes to break traction vs what percent of engine power it takes.
bin_bash 5y ago
> the brakes alone will not be sufficient to stop if the motor is attempting to accelerate Malcolm Gladwell went into detail about how this is BS on Revisionist History: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N3naJ0P0gM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N3naJ0P0gM It doesn't pass the smell test either: what car accelerates faster than it can stop?
- tesseract 5y ago
  > It doesn't pass the smell test either: what car accelerates faster than it can stop? A dragster? But more seriously, modern high-performance electric cars (such as some Tesla models) are capable of both acceleration and braking pretty much at their tires' adhesion limit. I would still expect the mechanical braking system to be designed to be able to overcome the maximum torque of the motor although I do not know whether or not that is in fact the case.
mywittyname 5y ago
> You'll find that for many vehicles, the brakes alone will not be sufficient to stop if the motor is attempting to accelerate; Maybe in 60s cars with 4 wheel drums. But the brake force on even basic modern cars is sufficient to overcome like 800hp. Go ahead and give it a shot in your own car and see. I have a 400+hp car with shitty brakes and it will still stop completely and readily if I hold down the throttle and brakes at the same time in second gear. Now, if you ride the brakes, they will overheat and lose stopping power. So you're going to want to actually try to stop the car.

sshine 5y ago

If the title had been “Tesla glitched at 83mph” it would have been exactly right and not less scary sounding.