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You can't always work through emotional dysregulation issues (inability to return to baseline after six hours of argument being one indicator of such issues) by

by AlanYx 5y ago

You can't always work through emotional dysregulation issues (inability to return to baseline after six hours of argument being one indicator of such issues) by just talking it out. Sometimes you can, sometimes it's associated with something more fundamental like a personality disorder where professional help needs to be involved.

RobertRoberts 5y ago
I have a theory I use that helps me with this, the "million dollar gun to the head" theory. Would either of them stop fighting instantly if there as a gun to their heads or offered a million dollars? If the answer is "yes", then it's entirely within their control to solve the problem. The only people I think that fail this are psychopaths, and I think those are rare.
- AlanYx 5y ago
  If you don't have experience with people prone to emotional dysregulation, it's hard to appreciate how it works, but you don't need to resort to such an artificial scenario like your gun scenario. People with some personality disorders can be triggered by seemingly little things into anger/rage states for 4-6 hours that cannot be resolved by talking them out, but if someone outside the household (i.e., someone who is not their partner or not their kids) shows up unexpectedly, they can often immediately control themselves. But the underlying dynamic doesn't get resolved, and generally won't be without professional tools that go beyond conventional talk therapy, like DBT.
  - agota 5y ago
    I came to a conclusion that people who genuinely can't control themselves due to extremely low impulse control tend to end up in prison. Those who claim that they "can't control themselves" yet somehow manage to be functional adults are lying - they can control themselves, they just can't be bothered.
  - lazide 5y ago
    Yup. Having been on the receiving end of it - she literally said afterwards she couldn’t stop herself. Luckily, she was just stabbing the counter and not me. My mistake for asking her how she was doing, apparently.
  - warcher 5y ago
    This is something I have been a witness to in my personal life, and you're right-- I don't have the tools to wrap my brain around this. I'm familiar with disabilities. I get that. You're unable to do this thing that other people find easy. But this.... this is a choice. If you can't regulate your emotions, you can't regulate your emotions no matter the context. If you can function just fine at work, but not at home, that's a choice you're making. Or at least, that's how it looks from the outside. I get that people who struggle to control their emotions would push back on that analogy, but I'm pretty accustomed to people creating whatever narrative they need to justify their behavior. Somebody acting badly and then making up a justification is something I deal with nearly every day. It's hard for me to get a better justification than "maybe your 'personality disorder' is just being an asshole" past Occam's razor. Is there something I could be reading about this to get a better picture? I know I'm coming at it from a general place of mental health, so, you know, that's not the best lens, but I also know I'm not crazy for thinking like this. Just maybe missing a puzzle piece.
  - pcthrowaway 5y ago
    This exact thing happened with my partner. Do you know what kinds of personality disorders are prone to this?
- toss1 5y ago
  To quantify "rare" it seems there are about 1% of the population are psychopaths [0]. A quick search came across a number of refs to that number, but IDK if it is multiple studies, or just one a long time ago that is amplified through time. [0] https://psichologyanswers.com/library/lecture/read/601609-what-percentage-of-the-us-are-psychopaths https://psichologyanswers.com/library/lecture/read/601609-wh...
thewebcount 5y ago
I just want to point out that it's not just personality disorders that can cause this. There are very real physiological problems that can surface this way, too. For example, some people have adrenaline issues where seemingly minor, or even pleasant things (like running into an old friend at the grocery store), cause a much larger than normal spike of adrenaline. If the person it happens to isn't aware of what's going on, they can react the way their body is telling them to (fight, flight, or freeze). Sometimes if they're aware of it, they can have enough sense to take a pause, but it is often very difficult because the biological response your body has is so overwhelming. It's as unpleasant for them as it is for the person who has to deal with their overreaction to the situation.
- zBard 5y ago
  Wouldn't personality disorders be inseparable from physiological problems ? Is there any particular literature/reference you are basing this on, curious.
deleted 5y ago
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by AlanYx 5y ago

RobertRoberts 5y ago

I have a theory I use that helps me with this, the "million dollar gun to the head" theory. Would either of them stop fighting instantly if there as a gun to their heads or offered a million dollars? If the answer is "yes", then it's entirely within their control to solve the problem. The only people I think that fail this are psychopaths, and I think those are rare.

AlanYx 5y ago
If you don't have experience with people prone to emotional dysregulation, it's hard to appreciate how it works, but you don't need to resort to such an artificial scenario like your gun scenario. People with some personality disorders can be triggered by seemingly little things into anger/rage states for 4-6 hours that cannot be resolved by talking them out, but if someone outside the household (i.e., someone who is not their partner or not their kids) shows up unexpectedly, they can often immediately control themselves. But the underlying dynamic doesn't get resolved, and generally won't be without professional tools that go beyond conventional talk therapy, like DBT.
- agota 5y ago
  I came to a conclusion that people who genuinely can't control themselves due to extremely low impulse control tend to end up in prison. Those who claim that they "can't control themselves" yet somehow manage to be functional adults are lying - they can control themselves, they just can't be bothered.
- lazide 5y ago
  Yup. Having been on the receiving end of it - she literally said afterwards she couldn’t stop herself. Luckily, she was just stabbing the counter and not me. My mistake for asking her how she was doing, apparently.
- warcher 5y ago
  This is something I have been a witness to in my personal life, and you're right-- I don't have the tools to wrap my brain around this. I'm familiar with disabilities. I get that. You're unable to do this thing that other people find easy. But this.... this is a choice. If you can't regulate your emotions, you can't regulate your emotions no matter the context. If you can function just fine at work, but not at home, that's a choice you're making. Or at least, that's how it looks from the outside. I get that people who struggle to control their emotions would push back on that analogy, but I'm pretty accustomed to people creating whatever narrative they need to justify their behavior. Somebody acting badly and then making up a justification is something I deal with nearly every day. It's hard for me to get a better justification than "maybe your 'personality disorder' is just being an asshole" past Occam's razor. Is there something I could be reading about this to get a better picture? I know I'm coming at it from a general place of mental health, so, you know, that's not the best lens, but I also know I'm not crazy for thinking like this. Just maybe missing a puzzle piece.
- pcthrowaway 5y ago
  This exact thing happened with my partner. Do you know what kinds of personality disorders are prone to this?
toss1 5y ago
To quantify "rare" it seems there are about 1% of the population are psychopaths [0]. A quick search came across a number of refs to that number, but IDK if it is multiple studies, or just one a long time ago that is amplified through time. [0] https://psichologyanswers.com/library/lecture/read/601609-what-percentage-of-the-us-are-psychopaths https://psichologyanswers.com/library/lecture/read/601609-wh...

thewebcount 5y ago

I just want to point out that it's not just personality disorders that can cause this. There are very real physiological problems that can surface this way, too. For example, some people have adrenaline issues where seemingly minor, or even pleasant things (like running into an old friend at the grocery store), cause a much larger than normal spike of adrenaline. If the person it happens to isn't aware of what's going on, they can react the way their body is telling them to (fight, flight, or freeze). Sometimes if they're aware of it, they can have enough sense to take a pause, but it is often very difficult because the biological response your body has is so overwhelming. It's as unpleasant for them as it is for the person who has to deal with their overreaction to the situation.

zBard 5y ago
Wouldn't personality disorders be inseparable from physiological problems ? Is there any particular literature/reference you are basing this on, curious.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]