5 ms·

I'm tentatively morbidity curious what happened to the VW bug, Fits and other cars this friend came in contact with.

zbrozek 5y ago
I'm also interested! I know a few classes of car destroyers. Some of them get into serious crashes. Some of them are more persistently mildly abusive or inattentive and do a lot of cosmetic and cleanliness damage. One person I know does ultra marathoning and uses his car like a locker room, so it smells like a great multitude of new bacterial species. Another one does zero maintenance and runs things until they don't go, ignoring all the warning messages.
- RajT88 5y ago
  My friend is for sure the inattentive type. This extends to road conditions. Getting stuck on medians, taking a corner in the rain too fast. Not noticing a tree while parking. Not noticing brakes making horrible screaming sounds. Not noticing after weeks of screaming sounds that the car starts diving for the left lane.
  - mschuster91 5y ago
    At that point they're a danger for others on the road.
  - exikyut 5y ago
    With my other comment upthread taken into account, and some awkward but necessary discussion about mental health gotten out of the way, I wonder if it might be an interesting idea to try track/rally racing. My thinking is here that if your friend has ADHD, that naturally imposes a "don't want to develop focus on details because not interesting" <-> "unaware of details in everyday life because no developed subconscious awareness of them" problem. Track and rally racing could neatly solve both sides of this status quo by merging them a la "oh no must learn to focus on details so as not to flip car and die". The idea would be to create a situation that is interesting enough to supercede the "I will treat this situation like a TV remote I have no idea how to use and push all the buttons on it until it works" instinct, by tuning the mental stimulus on the situation to correct for the inattentiveness threshold. A bit like putting music on to concentrate, just... faster. It's crazy enough it might work, *if* the caveats and risks can be managed. Apparently race drivers have the lowest reflexes of any sport. That sounds both like a good skill to have if you're inattentive, and kind of mutually incompatible with inattentiveness in the first place (like if you're a race driver it would basically just kick the inattentiveness out the window to some extent). Obviously this is a vErY bAd iDeA on its face, and would only be wise after some analysis of mental dysfunction and if this person was prepared to listen to everything the trained driver in the passenger seat was instructing them to do (in terms of pacing and learning and not simply just going "yay!" *floor accelerator*).
    - RajT88 5y ago
      I don't think he is mentally dysfunctional, beyond possibly ADHD. He just finished his PhD, and is fluent in 3 languages (English, Spanish, Japanese). If he finds something he's interested in, he'll dedicate his whole life to it and even minimize his social life until he's achieved whatever goal he's set out. I don't know what you'd call that. Driving is a thing he does in between the things he really wants to do, which is work and study mostly. > if this person was prepared to listen to everything the trained driver in the passenger seat was instructing them to do Not really his personality. Definitely a "figure it out yourself" type, and puts boundaries around the help and advice he asks for. Fiercely independent is I guess what you'd call it, definitely because of how he grew up (which I gather his family housed him, and fed him, but he mostly took care of himself emotionally). Definitely one of the more interesting people I know. Incredibly brilliant and talented at certain things, and wayyyyyyyy behind the curve in other areas.
      - exikyut 5y ago
        > If he finds something he's interested in, he'll dedicate his whole life to it and even minimize his social life until he's achieved whatever goal he's set out. I don't know what you'd call that. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperfocus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperfocus Zooming out into the abstract, it's interesting to observe the hazy relationship between ADHD and autism: https://web.archive.org/web/20220313151543/https://twitter.com/jojoandspoons/status/1458041447152750596 https://web.archive.org/web/20220313151543/https://twitter.c... - this is IMO an (interesting) example of structural multitasking/executive function issues and not just generalized hand-wave obsession. >> if this person was prepared to listen to everything the trained driver in the passenger seat was instructing them to do > Not really his personality. Definitely a "figure it out yourself" type, and puts boundaries around the help and advice he asks for. I have to admit I'm actually the same as this, due to a combination of learning difficulties and compounded negative experiences associated with getting things wrong. I still typically view tasks or opportunities in a very guarded way and tend to put a lot of conditions on things in an attempt to pin down the "win" state. Hmm, the trained driver could instead demonstrate several possible ways the car could be flipped, in a (very relatively) controlled and safe way. > Fiercely independent is I guess what you'd call it, definitely because of how he grew up (which I gather his family housed him, and fed him, but he mostly took care of himself emotionally). I was wondering about the emotional availability thing, very good point. It's so annoying how learning difficulties can be compounded so exponentially by receiving the wrong input :( -- In a total coincidence I just discovered https://old.reddit.com/r/StoriesAboutKevin https://old.reddit.com/r/StoriesAboutKevin earlier today - when I first stumbled on the Kevin concept some time ago (from the specific comment I linked) I had the fairly "haha so dumb" stereotype response, but reading so many stories in one place a deeper theme emerges around developmental balance and equilibrium. Half of these people are not hopeless lost causes but adequately-functioning people with a couple of mental health issues that just happen to cluster too closely around the "??!?!" end of the cognitive dissonance spectrum in ways that on first impression look like things a person should "just" have sorted out, and which are entirely the person's fault (with no consideration of circumstances etc) if they don't. It's a tad depressing this is a very nonscalable perspective I guess. I'd probably be a mid-range candidate for that subreddit myself ._.
- itronitron 5y ago
  Reminds me of the time I parked at a shopping mall next to an oddly parked car which otherwise looked normal except for a small mountain of what I think were used coffee grounds between the driver's seat and front passenger seat. This was in Seattle.
  - samus 5y ago
    Is this maybe supposed to work like putting coffee grounds into the fridge to absorb bad smells?
    - itronitron 5y ago
      That is certainly possible, and might be the only explanation that makes sense.
- exikyut 5y ago
  (Note also the reply at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31011310 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31011310 in case you haven't seen it)
RajT88 5y ago
There are so many stories... I will start before the Bug: Daewoo Nubira: Drove it until the brakes fell off. Among other oopsies. VW Bug: Among about $5k in damage from various bad decisions, eventually somehow got T-Boned on his way to traffic safety school. (Too many speeding tickets) He literally rolled up to traffic safety school in a wrecked car. Fit: I have asked a few times about the Honda fits. First time went like, "Hey is that the same Fit as before?" "No, shutup." No longer driving a Fit. Not sure what he has. It has been a colorful friendship.
- KennyBlanken 5y ago
  Maybe at some point you should suggest to your friend that they start taking driving more seriously before they kill someone. I'd be stunned if they haven't injured someone yet. I just don't get how "bad driver" is a haw-haw thing instead of a "what the hell wrong with you" thing.
  - RajT88 5y ago
    It's both. I try to exert some good influence where I can, but in general I do worry a lot about that particular friend.
- exikyut 5y ago
  My initial response was to suggest that next time you do anything like truth-or-dare, dare him to install a dashcam and press the save button and send you the footage every time. But that's obviously not really going to have a hilarious endgame at the end of the day, it's not like it'd be a lucky dashcam that's always in the right place at the right time capturing other cars. It'd just be awkward for everyone. Objectively speaking (in the interests of constructive assistance) I wonder if this person may be somewhere around "low but definitely non-zero" on the Kevin Spectrum (ad-hoc definition taken from https://old.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/219w2o//cgbhkwp/ https://old.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/219w2o//cgbhkwp/). If relevant, my next thought is whether some degree of cognitive issues may run in the family. I've noticed that one of the significant impacts of the developmental delays and perpetual catchup associated with my high-functioning autism has been a deeply-ingrained awareness of not just feeling "behind the curve" like I'm perpetually scrambling to keep up, but having hard evidence left right and center that I really am not simply Getting Gud. If this person grew up in either a hostile environment that cultivated a belief that it was impossible to ever do anything right, or simply a situation devoid of leadership to the extent he was left going round in circles due to lack of (for want of a better way to say it) developmental autocue, I could totally see some really terrible social anxiety, self-loathing, social detachment, and compounded awkwardness and depression developing from that. Getting traffic-jammed at the entry to a speedway that always seems too fast to merge onto, or stuck in front of a street curb with duckling legs that never grow to the point of scaling, can have an impact over the long term - The Show Must Go On, and staying relevant isn't really a question in the fight for survival, so the only really viable option is to hack it and pretend that everything mostly works. Extrapolating this status quo and envisaging the worst-case-scenario end state, I'd imagine it would be like waking up one day and realizing the biggest themes in my life were a) the giant delta between how much I pretend to have sorted out and what I can really keep up with, b) how much I'm pretty much blindly depending on some circumstantial alignment to happen soon to provide some opportunity to catch up and maybe get some confidence, c) the terrifyingly disproportionate amount of calling life's bluff I'm doing on a regular basis and d) how much I have have to cram this stuff into the nearest can and sit on the lid in order to cope. If the situation I was in resembled the above, attempting to discuss it (particularly considering (d)) would probably produce a reactive and shouty mess. It would be very difficult. But it could prove life-saving.

I'm also interested! I know a few classes of car destroyers. Some of them get into serious crashes. Some of them are more persistently mildly abusive or inattentive and do a lot of cosmetic and cleanliness damage. One person I know does ultra marathoning and uses his car like a locker room, so it smells like a great multitude of new bacterial species. Another one does zero maintenance and runs things until they don't go, ignoring all the warning messages.

RajT88 5y ago
My friend is for sure the inattentive type. This extends to road conditions. Getting stuck on medians, taking a corner in the rain too fast. Not noticing a tree while parking. Not noticing brakes making horrible screaming sounds. Not noticing after weeks of screaming sounds that the car starts diving for the left lane.
- mschuster91 5y ago
  At that point they're a danger for others on the road.
- exikyut 5y ago
  With my other comment upthread taken into account, and some awkward but necessary discussion about mental health gotten out of the way, I wonder if it might be an interesting idea to try track/rally racing. My thinking is here that if your friend has ADHD, that naturally imposes a "don't want to develop focus on details because not interesting" <-> "unaware of details in everyday life because no developed subconscious awareness of them" problem. Track and rally racing could neatly solve both sides of this status quo by merging them a la "oh no must learn to focus on details so as not to flip car and die". The idea would be to create a situation that is interesting enough to supercede the "I will treat this situation like a TV remote I have no idea how to use and push all the buttons on it until it works" instinct, by tuning the mental stimulus on the situation to correct for the inattentiveness threshold. A bit like putting music on to concentrate, just... faster. It's crazy enough it might work, *if* the caveats and risks can be managed. Apparently race drivers have the lowest reflexes of any sport. That sounds both like a good skill to have if you're inattentive, and kind of mutually incompatible with inattentiveness in the first place (like if you're a race driver it would basically just kick the inattentiveness out the window to some extent). Obviously this is a vErY bAd iDeA on its face, and would only be wise after some analysis of mental dysfunction and if this person was prepared to listen to everything the trained driver in the passenger seat was instructing them to do (in terms of pacing and learning and not simply just going "yay!" *floor accelerator*).
  - RajT88 5y ago
    I don't think he is mentally dysfunctional, beyond possibly ADHD. He just finished his PhD, and is fluent in 3 languages (English, Spanish, Japanese). If he finds something he's interested in, he'll dedicate his whole life to it and even minimize his social life until he's achieved whatever goal he's set out. I don't know what you'd call that. Driving is a thing he does in between the things he really wants to do, which is work and study mostly. > if this person was prepared to listen to everything the trained driver in the passenger seat was instructing them to do Not really his personality. Definitely a "figure it out yourself" type, and puts boundaries around the help and advice he asks for. Fiercely independent is I guess what you'd call it, definitely because of how he grew up (which I gather his family housed him, and fed him, but he mostly took care of himself emotionally). Definitely one of the more interesting people I know. Incredibly brilliant and talented at certain things, and wayyyyyyyy behind the curve in other areas.
    - exikyut 5y ago
      > If he finds something he's interested in, he'll dedicate his whole life to it and even minimize his social life until he's achieved whatever goal he's set out. I don't know what you'd call that. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperfocus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperfocus Zooming out into the abstract, it's interesting to observe the hazy relationship between ADHD and autism: https://web.archive.org/web/20220313151543/https://twitter.com/jojoandspoons/status/1458041447152750596 https://web.archive.org/web/20220313151543/https://twitter.c... - this is IMO an (interesting) example of structural multitasking/executive function issues and not just generalized hand-wave obsession. >> if this person was prepared to listen to everything the trained driver in the passenger seat was instructing them to do > Not really his personality. Definitely a "figure it out yourself" type, and puts boundaries around the help and advice he asks for. I have to admit I'm actually the same as this, due to a combination of learning difficulties and compounded negative experiences associated with getting things wrong. I still typically view tasks or opportunities in a very guarded way and tend to put a lot of conditions on things in an attempt to pin down the "win" state. Hmm, the trained driver could instead demonstrate several possible ways the car could be flipped, in a (very relatively) controlled and safe way. > Fiercely independent is I guess what you'd call it, definitely because of how he grew up (which I gather his family housed him, and fed him, but he mostly took care of himself emotionally). I was wondering about the emotional availability thing, very good point. It's so annoying how learning difficulties can be compounded so exponentially by receiving the wrong input :( -- In a total coincidence I just discovered https://old.reddit.com/r/StoriesAboutKevin https://old.reddit.com/r/StoriesAboutKevin earlier today - when I first stumbled on the Kevin concept some time ago (from the specific comment I linked) I had the fairly "haha so dumb" stereotype response, but reading so many stories in one place a deeper theme emerges around developmental balance and equilibrium. Half of these people are not hopeless lost causes but adequately-functioning people with a couple of mental health issues that just happen to cluster too closely around the "??!?!" end of the cognitive dissonance spectrum in ways that on first impression look like things a person should "just" have sorted out, and which are entirely the person's fault (with no consideration of circumstances etc) if they don't. It's a tad depressing this is a very nonscalable perspective I guess. I'd probably be a mid-range candidate for that subreddit myself ._.
itronitron 5y ago
Reminds me of the time I parked at a shopping mall next to an oddly parked car which otherwise looked normal except for a small mountain of what I think were used coffee grounds between the driver's seat and front passenger seat. This was in Seattle.
- samus 5y ago
  Is this maybe supposed to work like putting coffee grounds into the fridge to absorb bad smells?
  - itronitron 5y ago
    That is certainly possible, and might be the only explanation that makes sense.
exikyut 5y ago
(Note also the reply at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31011310 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31011310 in case you haven't seen it)

RajT88 5y ago

There are so many stories... I will start before the Bug: Daewoo Nubira: Drove it until the brakes fell off. Among other oopsies. VW Bug: Among about $5k in damage from various bad decisions, eventually somehow got T-Boned on his way to traffic safety school. (Too many speeding tickets) He literally rolled up to traffic safety school in a wrecked car. Fit: I have asked a few times about the Honda fits. First time went like, "Hey is that the same Fit as before?" "No, shutup." No longer driving a Fit. Not sure what he has. It has been a colorful friendship.

KennyBlanken 5y ago
Maybe at some point you should suggest to your friend that they start taking driving more seriously before they kill someone. I'd be stunned if they haven't injured someone yet. I just don't get how "bad driver" is a haw-haw thing instead of a "what the hell wrong with you" thing.
- RajT88 5y ago
  It's both. I try to exert some good influence where I can, but in general I do worry a lot about that particular friend.
exikyut 5y ago
My initial response was to suggest that next time you do anything like truth-or-dare, dare him to install a dashcam and press the save button and send you the footage every time. But that's obviously not really going to have a hilarious endgame at the end of the day, it's not like it'd be a lucky dashcam that's always in the right place at the right time capturing other cars. It'd just be awkward for everyone. Objectively speaking (in the interests of constructive assistance) I wonder if this person may be somewhere around "low but definitely non-zero" on the Kevin Spectrum (ad-hoc definition taken from https://old.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/219w2o//cgbhkwp/ https://old.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/219w2o//cgbhkwp/). If relevant, my next thought is whether some degree of cognitive issues may run in the family. I've noticed that one of the significant impacts of the developmental delays and perpetual catchup associated with my high-functioning autism has been a deeply-ingrained awareness of not just feeling "behind the curve" like I'm perpetually scrambling to keep up, but having hard evidence left right and center that I really am not simply Getting Gud. If this person grew up in either a hostile environment that cultivated a belief that it was impossible to ever do anything right, or simply a situation devoid of leadership to the extent he was left going round in circles due to lack of (for want of a better way to say it) developmental autocue, I could totally see some really terrible social anxiety, self-loathing, social detachment, and compounded awkwardness and depression developing from that. Getting traffic-jammed at the entry to a speedway that always seems too fast to merge onto, or stuck in front of a street curb with duckling legs that never grow to the point of scaling, can have an impact over the long term - The Show Must Go On, and staying relevant isn't really a question in the fight for survival, so the only really viable option is to hack it and pretend that everything mostly works. Extrapolating this status quo and envisaging the worst-case-scenario end state, I'd imagine it would be like waking up one day and realizing the biggest themes in my life were a) the giant delta between how much I pretend to have sorted out and what I can really keep up with, b) how much I'm pretty much blindly depending on some circumstantial alignment to happen soon to provide some opportunity to catch up and maybe get some confidence, c) the terrifyingly disproportionate amount of calling life's bluff I'm doing on a regular basis and d) how much I have have to cram this stuff into the nearest can and sit on the lid in order to cope. If the situation I was in resembled the above, attempting to discuss it (particularly considering (d)) would probably produce a reactive and shouty mess. It would be very difficult. But it could prove life-saving.