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> why there's so much interest in nuclear when low-tech concentrated solar in the desert can get the job done and scaling it up (and ensuring it's 100% safe) is
by Sebb767 5y ago
> why there's so much interest in nuclear when low-tech concentrated solar in the desert can get the job done and scaling it up (and ensuring it's 100% safe) isn't a matter of R&D but just basic manufacturing.
Solar is dependent on the time of day (as the sister comments pointed out) and also on weather. Plus, you need to get the energy from the desert to wherever it's needed - this is non-trivial for densely populated areas far from the equator. You also need to maintain the solar panels; sand can be quite bad for their efficiency. Lastly, the areas that do have the space and solar power might be politically unstable, which makes the massive investments needed to get this going quite risky.
Real engineering has a good video about this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7OpM_zKGE4o https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7OpM_zKGE4o
- KennyBlanken 5y agoWhich is why a lot of generating capacity is wind, not just solar. Which is why utilities are focusing on energy storage and grid improvements like upgrading transmission lines to HVDC to make it more practical to 'ship' excess wind/solar to regions that need it.
- vorpalhex 5y agoBatteries require some pretty rare and gnarly materials and still hold only a tiny, tiny bit. It still gets dark for about a third of the day.
- truffdog 5y agoYou can always store energy by pushing rocks uphill.
- ElectricalUnion 5y agoThe issue is then recovering the energy from said rocks, or not wasting too much energy lifting the rocks in the first place.
- chriswarbo 5y agoGravity is an incredibly feeble force; storing large amounts of energy this way requires a lot of rocks and a lot of land.
- pydry 5y agohttps://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fengning_Pumped_Storage_Power_Station https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fengning_Pumped_Storage_Powe... Pushing water uphill is relatively cheap and ~80% efficient. We can build more 2x nuclear power station equivalent "batteries" like fengning fairly easily.
- laurencerowe 5y agoAre there many sites with appropriate geology to build any substantial number of pumped storage stations?
- pydry 5y agoCant find it now but there was a study i remember seeing that suggested that there were 100x as many as needed.
- putnambr 5y agoHow about any of the reservoirs in drought-stricken North America? Water could be pumped to Lake Mead, power generated at Hoover Dam, and then enter irrigation for farmland. Same for almost the entirety of the Snake River and tributaries.
- JohnHaugeland 5y agoMaybe you weren't aware, but those sites are drying out thanks to climate change, and have some other important responsibilities like drinking water Hydro is failing worldwide. Look it up before responding please, thanks.
- JohnHaugeland 5y agoI love when people who have no familiarity with the long and failed history of water batteries assume it's easy
- chriswarbo 5y agoGrid storage has different constraints than, e.g. electric vehicles; in particular, size and weight is less important since they aren't moving. This makes it viable to use battery tech which is less efficient, but cheaper/safer/etc. For example, flow batteries or iron/air batteries.
- ncmncm 5y agoDisinformation is not welcome here There is absolutely no need for deserts, or for single-use solar farms anywhere. Solar coexists with roofs, parking lots, reservoirs and canals, and pasture, improving each.
- Sebb767 5y agoThe grandparent explicitly asked why solar in the desert is not considered as a solution. Also, pointing out the actual flaws of a specific approach is not disinformation.
- tlb 5y agoPlease don't claim disinformation unless there's evidence of intentional deception, which doesn't appear to the case here. Instead, try to add to the discussion. For example, your claim raises the question of why many existing solar farms were built in deserts. Did something change since they were built?
- cinntaile 5y agoThey turn unproductive, cheap land into something more valuable. A second advantage is that it helps combat desertification. A downside is that the temperatures reduce the efficiency of the panels so you need to mitigate that.
- JohnHaugeland 5y agoAt any time that someone with no personal knowledge takes a contrarian position of fact, this has been achieved. It's long past time to try to protect the world's energy anti-vaxxers.
- godelski 5y agoDisinformation: spreading false information while knowing the information is false. Misinformation: spreading false information while believing the false information. We should be mindful how we use these terms. I believe that the parent to your comment fully believes what they are saying. If you wish to act in good faith just provide a few sources or comments to counter their claims and move on. Consider the context in which they are speaking (the op mentions building in deserts and sending electricity elsewhere, hence the counter). But do not attack them and call them a bad actor until benefit of the doubt is removed. We can't have a functioning community unless we operate under good faith conditions, even to bad actors. https://www.mediadefence.org/ereader/publications/introductory-modules-on-digital-rights-and-freedom-of-expression-online/module-8-false-news-misinformation-and-propaganda/misinformation-disinformation-and-mal-information/ https://www.mediadefence.org/ereader/publications/introducto...
- teucris 5y agoI wonder if some combination solar and mechanical storage, e.g. pumped storage hydropower could be engineered to outperform nuclear. PSH is pretty inefficient, but solar is getting cheaper and cheaper…