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COVID is pretty much over, lockdowns and mask mandates are being lifted around the free world. However authoritarian governments will likely continue to use it

COVID is pretty much over, lockdowns and mask mandates are being lifted around the free world. However authoritarian governments will likely continue to use it as a lame excuse for years to come.

eynsham 5y ago
China also has much less naturally acquired immunity than everywhere else, and (mysteriously) refuses to make that up with vaccines—it’s not just an excuse, unlike in those authoritarian countries where immunity has already been built up so a lockdown would make a much smaller difference.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
sudosysgen 5y ago
It certainly isn't. Doubly vaccinated people are getting reinfected within a month. We just decided to roll the dice on the long term risks of such a disease.
- _abox 5y ago
  True, I got covid 2 weeks after getting my booster (3rd mRNA dose). At a point where protection should have been optimal. However it only gave me slight sniffles for 2 days. The vaccine made me more sick :) so IMO the vaccine did its job. I agree with rolling the dice on this. We can't keep locking thingals down forever and masks only delay an eventual infection anyway. The anti covid measures do their own damage on our health and economy so I'm happy with the relaxation.
  - sudosysgen 5y ago
    Ah, what I'm talking about is something else - people are being infected through the vaccine, and get a second breakthrough infection within a month of the first one. I don't know how widespread it is. Reinfections are generally milder than the first infection, but it's not the case every time. If we let the virus run through like wildfire and accumulate mutation after mutation as it runs through billions of hosts every few months, there is a chance it has a huge cost on society. This is pretty unique, too. Normally, people can go multiple years before reinfection even without vaccines. A virus that can reinfect after mere months and is this infectious is inherently very risky. A nightmare scenario would be one where people keep catching it every few months without it getting less severe after the first few times.
    - GekkePrutser 5y ago
      Is a scenario where we have to work from home a couple of times a year for a few days due to a mild infection really such a nightmare? Considering the constant lockdowns we'll need to prevent it, that sounds a lot worse tbh. Of course it's possible a dangerous strain will emerge but I think it's worth the risk.
      - sudosysgen 5y ago
        There is a lot more that can be done besides lockdowns - we can have actually useful contact tracing and testing. There are tons of measures that can be implemented to reduce transmission. We're giving up on all of that. Besides, viral infections are very damaging to the human body. An infection severe enough to knock you out for multiple days multiple times a year, on top of all the other disease we have, each time rolling the dice on long term side effects, is far worse than "work from home a couple of times a day". If there is an only 5% rate of long term side effects (which is much less than it is at now), and you end up catching it twice a year, that means you're guaranteeing most people to suffer from long term side effects. Not to mention, unless we're sending sick kids to school, parents will be in deep shit. And on a personal preference level, I would much rather have a week or two of lockdown every year on average until we can develop a vaccine that can prevent reinfection and mutation or treatments and testing or w/e is needed to limit it, than to be guaranteed to get sick for a week or two at random times alone and risk severe long term effects every time. Even the Chinese didn't have constant lockdowns. The majority of Chinese people didn't even see a single lockdown this year. If their government was competent enough to keep a basic surveillance testing regime the lockdown in Shanghai might have already been over.
        spookthesunset 5y ago
        I absolutely love the goalposts for some people seem to have shifted from “this ends when we have a vaccine” all the way to “this ends when we have a newer, better vaccine”. When will people finally accept this is a battle that cannot be won. Humans cannot stop a contagious respiratory virus any better than they can stop a hurricane, tornado or earthquake.
vkou 5y ago
'Covid is over', yet daily case counts are higher than at any point in time except during the first omicron surge. Over 1 million a day, at the moment. The only thing that's over is the media's interest in talking about it, over other vitally important topics, like Will Smith.
- robonerd 5y ago
  Infection counts are irrelevant. What matters is that relatively few people will be killed by it because vaccination (even the shitty Chinese vax) and natural immunity have changed the equation. In my progressive west coast city, even front-line customer service workers like grocery store employees are abandoning their masks. Covid is becoming endemic, yet mostly harmless. Zero-covid is a delusion for totalitarians.
  - legulere 5y ago
    Death rate is still pretty high in a lot of western countries though: https://ourworldindata.org/covid-deaths https://ourworldindata.org/covid-deaths
    - NicoJuicy 5y ago
      Without lockdowns to flatten the curve. It's not similar at all
somewhereoutth 5y ago
You mean our fight against Covid is pretty much over - and has ended with complete capitulation. We are now letting it do as it will, for better or for worse - surrendering to our fate.
- NicoJuicy 5y ago
  You do realize we have vaccines now, no?
  - somewhereoutth 5y ago
    It doesn't seem that vaccines can be the complete answer - due to waning and variant mutational avoidance. Unlike measles vaccine. Hence other measures may be necessary if we wish to control Covid
    - NicoJuicy 5y ago
      Warning efficiency vs. Infection, not deaths. And omicron is practically harmless for the vaccinated.
- spookthesunset 5y ago
  What was the alternative?
  - somewhereoutth 5y ago
    Better ventilation of indoor spaces, more utilisation of outdoor spaces, better sick pay provision, more WFH, etc, etc - essentially the complete mobilisation of society to defeat COVID, whatever it took. A dress rehearsal for climate change.
    - GekkePrutser 5y ago
      I don't think covid was bad enough to warrant complete mobilisation of society. Climate change yes. If anything it hurt our fight against climate change. There were some short-term benefits like reduced travel but overall it has increased inflation a lot due to the massive costs of the lockdowns. We're all a bit poorer and guess what, poor people have less to spend on climate-positive products and tend to go for the cheaper but worse options. We should pick our battles for the ones that count.

COVID is pretty much over, lockdowns and mask mandates are being lifted around the free world. However authoritarian governments will likely continue to use it as a lame excuse for years to come.

eynsham 5y ago

China also has much less naturally acquired immunity than everywhere else, and (mysteriously) refuses to make that up with vaccines—it’s not just an excuse, unlike in those authoritarian countries where immunity has already been built up so a lockdown would make a much smaller difference.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

sudosysgen 5y ago

It certainly isn't. Doubly vaccinated people are getting reinfected within a month. We just decided to roll the dice on the long term risks of such a disease.

_abox 5y ago
True, I got covid 2 weeks after getting my booster (3rd mRNA dose). At a point where protection should have been optimal. However it only gave me slight sniffles for 2 days. The vaccine made me more sick :) so IMO the vaccine did its job. I agree with rolling the dice on this. We can't keep locking thingals down forever and masks only delay an eventual infection anyway. The anti covid measures do their own damage on our health and economy so I'm happy with the relaxation.
- sudosysgen 5y ago
  Ah, what I'm talking about is something else - people are being infected through the vaccine, and get a second breakthrough infection within a month of the first one. I don't know how widespread it is. Reinfections are generally milder than the first infection, but it's not the case every time. If we let the virus run through like wildfire and accumulate mutation after mutation as it runs through billions of hosts every few months, there is a chance it has a huge cost on society. This is pretty unique, too. Normally, people can go multiple years before reinfection even without vaccines. A virus that can reinfect after mere months and is this infectious is inherently very risky. A nightmare scenario would be one where people keep catching it every few months without it getting less severe after the first few times.
  - GekkePrutser 5y ago
    Is a scenario where we have to work from home a couple of times a year for a few days due to a mild infection really such a nightmare? Considering the constant lockdowns we'll need to prevent it, that sounds a lot worse tbh. Of course it's possible a dangerous strain will emerge but I think it's worth the risk.
    - sudosysgen 5y ago
      There is a lot more that can be done besides lockdowns - we can have actually useful contact tracing and testing. There are tons of measures that can be implemented to reduce transmission. We're giving up on all of that. Besides, viral infections are very damaging to the human body. An infection severe enough to knock you out for multiple days multiple times a year, on top of all the other disease we have, each time rolling the dice on long term side effects, is far worse than "work from home a couple of times a day". If there is an only 5% rate of long term side effects (which is much less than it is at now), and you end up catching it twice a year, that means you're guaranteeing most people to suffer from long term side effects. Not to mention, unless we're sending sick kids to school, parents will be in deep shit. And on a personal preference level, I would much rather have a week or two of lockdown every year on average until we can develop a vaccine that can prevent reinfection and mutation or treatments and testing or w/e is needed to limit it, than to be guaranteed to get sick for a week or two at random times alone and risk severe long term effects every time. Even the Chinese didn't have constant lockdowns. The majority of Chinese people didn't even see a single lockdown this year. If their government was competent enough to keep a basic surveillance testing regime the lockdown in Shanghai might have already been over.
      - spookthesunset 5y ago
        I absolutely love the goalposts for some people seem to have shifted from “this ends when we have a vaccine” all the way to “this ends when we have a newer, better vaccine”. When will people finally accept this is a battle that cannot be won. Humans cannot stop a contagious respiratory virus any better than they can stop a hurricane, tornado or earthquake.

vkou 5y ago

'Covid is over', yet daily case counts are higher than at any point in time except during the first omicron surge. Over 1 million a day, at the moment. The only thing that's over is the media's interest in talking about it, over other vitally important topics, like Will Smith.

robonerd 5y ago
Infection counts are irrelevant. What matters is that relatively few people will be killed by it because vaccination (even the shitty Chinese vax) and natural immunity have changed the equation. In my progressive west coast city, even front-line customer service workers like grocery store employees are abandoning their masks. Covid is becoming endemic, yet mostly harmless. Zero-covid is a delusion for totalitarians.
- legulere 5y ago
  Death rate is still pretty high in a lot of western countries though: https://ourworldindata.org/covid-deaths https://ourworldindata.org/covid-deaths
  - NicoJuicy 5y ago
    Without lockdowns to flatten the curve. It's not similar at all

somewhereoutth 5y ago

You mean our fight against Covid is pretty much over - and has ended with complete capitulation. We are now letting it do as it will, for better or for worse - surrendering to our fate.

NicoJuicy 5y ago
You do realize we have vaccines now, no?
- somewhereoutth 5y ago
  It doesn't seem that vaccines can be the complete answer - due to waning and variant mutational avoidance. Unlike measles vaccine. Hence other measures may be necessary if we wish to control Covid
  - NicoJuicy 5y ago
    Warning efficiency vs. Infection, not deaths. And omicron is practically harmless for the vaccinated.
spookthesunset 5y ago
What was the alternative?
- somewhereoutth 5y ago
  Better ventilation of indoor spaces, more utilisation of outdoor spaces, better sick pay provision, more WFH, etc, etc - essentially the complete mobilisation of society to defeat COVID, whatever it took. A dress rehearsal for climate change.
  - GekkePrutser 5y ago
    I don't think covid was bad enough to warrant complete mobilisation of society. Climate change yes. If anything it hurt our fight against climate change. There were some short-term benefits like reduced travel but overall it has increased inflation a lot due to the massive costs of the lockdowns. We're all a bit poorer and guess what, poor people have less to spend on climate-positive products and tend to go for the cheaper but worse options. We should pick our battles for the ones that count.