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It will be hard because India likes to buy from Russia recently and doesn't see a problem with invasion.
by krzyk 5y ago
It will be hard because India likes to buy from Russia recently and doesn't see a problem with invasion.
- ra7 5y agoHuh? They’ve repeatedly said they don’t support violence and has offered to mediate between Russia and Ukraine. Just because they’re looking out for their economic needs — which are wildly different than developed nations — doesn’t mean they support the invasion.
- chrischen 5y agoIf you asked the Russians they’d probably also tell you they don’t support the violence.
- mongol 5y agoIf they don't support it, they have had plenty of opportunities to voice against it. But they have abstained. It is really disappointing.
- ra7 5y agoYes, but that doesn’t come close to supporting the war. On the other hand, they’ve provided considerable humanitarian assistance to Ukraine. For better or worse, that’s just the situation — economic and geopolitical — India is in. They don’t have the luxury of looking at things black and white like most western nations.
- mongol 5y agoThe situation in Ukraine is more black and white than most others. That India can't recognize that both surprised me and disappointed me. It would make a big difference if they dared to speak out against Russian agression. Even if they would like to remain on friendly terms with Russia they should recognize the atrociousy which Russia displays in Ukraine. Putin needs to hear it also from India.
- throwaway_1928 5y agoThis is a simplistic assessment of India's strategic situation.
- krzyk 5y agoYour point being? They literally hosted Russia Foreign Minister week or two ago. They abstained in votes against Russia for that invasion in UN. US warned them no to go in bed with Russia. Do you think EU or US will look kindly to support India now?
- throwaway_1928 5y agoThe US and EU governments have a much deeper understanding of India's strategic position than your comment gives them credit for.
- mama123 5y agoSo your point is let the conflict brew and let us isolate Russia but let us not help negotiate peace.
- krzyk 5y agoMy point it let Russia loose. Let it be beaten by smaller country. Let it be beaten by a country (some) they say shouldn't exist. Let this Soviet imperialism die once and for all. Split it up into smaller countries, there are too many nationalities in there and most of the resources sit in Asian part, let the people there take the fruits. This country needs to be cleaned from the head, just like Germany after WWII. If not it will always be a danger to world peace.
- chrischen 5y agoThe real geopolitics behind this is that Russia is trying to curb NATO influence. So this war is really about hurting NATO. A Russian loss helps NATO and a victory hurts NATO, but the war can be ended if either side makes the requisite concessions. But for unaffiliated parties they don’t necessarily take a pro-NATO stance so anti-war or anti-violence simply means “somebody please give in” rather than “NATO please win.” Asking India, or even China for this matter, to make sacrifices for the benefit of NATO is an unrealistic position to take.
- oblio 5y agoYou use a lot of words in your post but none are "Ukraine". Ukrainians have the right to decide what they want to do and what, if anything, to give up.
- chrischen 5y agoUkrainians certainly can, but you can't ignore the fact that a lot of NATO's motivations for helping isn't just altruism. Part of this is also the proxy war being fought, and even if India and China want Ukraine to win, they may not want to be the ones paying for a NATO victory.
- oblio 5y agoSmall wars almost always drag in bigger powers. But that doesn't change much. The US intervened in Vietnam and Afghanistan and because the locals didn't want them, the US still lost. Foreign contributions in Ukraine pale in comparison to Vietnam and Afghanistan yet Ukraine is resisting. And this a full blown Russian invasion, not just a Ukrainian civil war, yet Ukraine might even win this war. That's strictly the merit of the Ukrainians. You can gift weapons, but not the will to fight.
- Koshkin 5y ago> Ukrainians have the right Not yet, apparently, but they are fighting for it.
- sidibe 5y ago
- zaptheimpaler 5y agoGermany continues to buy oil from Russia too, but I never see them being criticized for it. They bought oil for decades from Russia, arguably funding the current invasion, yet that was held up as a shining example of how interdepenence via trading can maintain peace between nations. There's always a double standard at play. For EU, buying oil is a necessary evil. For India, it's "supporting" the enemy.
- krzyk 5y agoYou didn't see Germany criticized for buying oil from Russia? Boy, they are the most criticized country for doing that (and oil and gas) - they basically enabled Russia to do the invasion. Nord Stream 1 and 2 come to mind. They made themselves (and few other countries) dependent on that bloody import. India received Lawrow recently, he is not allowed in any EU country. But there is a difference in long dependency and completely new buy. India is not dependent on Russian oil, Germany is (I mean, if they stop, cars will stop, people will freeze in houses because of lack of gas to heat their houses).
- warner_of_doom 5y ago> India received Lawrow recently, he is not allowed in any EU country. And? Your point? Speaking to diplomats is suddenly taboo? > India is not dependent on Russian oil No. But, it is dependent on oil and gas being cheap enough to make basic inputs with. It is a region and country on the brink of poverty in many ways. What did you expect?
- krzyk 5y ago> And? Your point? Speaking to diplomats is suddenly taboo? You can speak on phone, receiving one from countries killing civilians on purpose is making a statement. If you make a statement you will be heard, and I don't think many EU countries will be happy. Not to mention, you know humanitarian aspects - you can buy your oil without blood.
- warner_of_doom 5y ago
- yumraj 5y agoAs always the reality is complicated, and yes, India does see a problem with the invasion. India is not like China where the media is openly supporting the Russian narrative. India is merely keeping quiet, with many in the media telling it to take a more open position against Russia. India has massive dependency on Russian military hardware and spare parts. So what should it do, just break off with Russia over a war in the Europe and get screwed itself when China-Pak nexus comes knocking on the border? No country in the world would do that, none-zero-zilch… Moreover, Europe itself is buying Russian oil and gas, and wants India to stop - that reeks of double standards.. International politics is much murkier than national politics, so nothing is ever black or white.
- krzyk 5y agoWhole Eastern Europe has mostly Russian military hardware and guess what, we are basically enemies with Russia and we manage. We buy new equipment from Western countries now but large majority of equipment is still Soviet made. Choices. BTW. Regarding the oil and gas, India started buying when it didn't need to . EU is dependent on that oil and gas (Eastern Europe was forced on that dependency, Westerners stupidly joined) - e.g. cars will stop on streets, people will freeze in houses (ok, maybe not now, fortunately Spring is coming, but we still have 0-8 Celcius here, not fun to be in unheated house in that temperature). And we try to stop it, e.g. in Poland we worked on that and hopefully by the end of the year we can stop importing gas from Russia.
- warner_of_doom 5y agoIndia needs cheap oil and gas to make fertilizers to feed its population. You are free and rich enough to do this, be my guest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iD_6L_ktkM8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iD_6L_ktkM8
- yumraj 5y ago> Whole Eastern Europe has mostly Russian military hardware and guess what, we are basically enemies with Russia and we manage. There is a difference: you don’t have a choice, Russia is the enemy as well as from where where you’d sourced hardware. Moreover, per my understanding, a lot of hardware and spares are manufactured in E. Eu, due to Soviet era, so things are slightly better due to that. India is different, the enemy is China-Pak nexus. Russia has never been India’s enemy, rather has been friendly as a counter against US which for decades was more friendly towards Pak and even China. Kissinger hated India for some reason. Also, India doesn’t manufacture a lot of spares for military hardware. India is trying to reduce dependency on Russian crap by buying from West, note the Rafale deal. So it will happen, it will just take time. Note: India has the 2nd largest army in the world, so things take time. > India started buying when it didn't need to India started buying exactly when it needed to, when the price went over $100 a barrel which has a huge economic impact. Just like Eu is still buying Russian oil and gas. It’s not fair to express your own reasons while not understanding the other’s. No one in India is doing this out of love for Russia, the history is in the past, but out of strategic reasons - which is what countries do.
- 1024core 5y agoComments like this make me really mad. Do you know that Europe is _still_ buying from Russia?? Do you know that the US is also _still_ buying from Russia?? India does about $8Bn/year of trade with Russia. That's peanuts. And nearly 50% of the tankers carrying Russian oil are Greek; and yet you don't hear a word about Greece.
- krzyk 5y agoIssue is that India started new trade with Russia, it is not dependent on it (like Europe, I don't know what the heck US is doing), they just jumped on opportunity. And Europe works hard on stopping that, but it is a bit hard to stop e.g. gas import if your own supply won't be able to heat people homes (it is not India, in Europe we are just starting spring, but still temperatures can hit freezing point). I didn't know about Greece, I was wondering how in the world was Russia transporting that oil and wheat.
- ddaalluu2 5y agoI don't see a problem in trade with Russia. We certainly don't have the moral high ground, also trade is good for peace and living standards.
- krzyk 5y agoEurope also thought that trade is good for peace, but it is not if you trade with some countries with long history of double crossing others.
- muzaffarpur 5y agoYeah, expanding NATO everyday post 1989 was a great idea for trade?
- krzyk 5y agoYes, it was, Russians didn't attack NATO members. And countries desperately want to join so they won't be attacked by Russia. NATO will loose its purpose when Russia disappears.
- warner_of_doom 5y agoWow. The manufactured consent generating machine is still working as expected.
- narrator 5y agoYou never ever oppose "the current thing."
- warner_of_doom 5y agoExactly. 0 consideration that the media may be constructing narratives and feeding them to us, instead of being objective.
- mama123 5y agoIt is more like India doesn't trust that the west actually has an intent of stopping the conflict. Or that Europe would in anyway want to give up on its Russian gas and oil, while pointing fingers at India which buys less than 1%. In fact they fear it might go the same way as the sanctions on Iran, where India had to go through Germany banks to pay its Iranian dues, where Indian banks were expected to abide by sanctions while German banks were not.
- mama123 5y agoAnd did you consult India before you orchestrated the regime changes and laid the seeds for conflict. India isn't a colony, and India is capable of and willing to be a mediator to bring peace, the west isn't or won't.
- krzyk 5y ago> And did you consult India before you orchestrated the regime changes and laid the seeds for conflict. What regime changes, what orchestration?
- muzaffarpur 5y agoNATO/EU and US are allies/friends and West never been friend or kind to India/Indians.
- krzyk 5y agoI was referring to this part from grandparent: > The US, Europe, and allies should be doing whatever we can to support this.