4 ms·

The crossover I never knew I wanted but am glad to see Does anyone know of any services that offer all the backing services for add-ons for thunderbird: WebDAV

The crossover I never knew I wanted but am glad to see Does anyone know of any services that offer all the backing services for add-ons for thunderbird: WebDAV for filelink, CalDAV, CardDAV, (and now) Matrix?

jakecopp 5y ago
I haven't heard of anyone that hosts both Matrix & Mail/Calendar/Contacts. That would be a really interesting enterprise solution though - effectively replacing Slack/Teams for internal comms!
- dflock 5y ago
  NextCloud does all this, afaik.
- pmw 5y ago
  Fastmail has been that all-in solution. They host Mail/Calendar/Contacts, and they used to host XMPP/Jabber. But unfortunately they made the decision to shut down XMPP (https://fastmail.blog/historical/shutting-down-our-xmpp-chat-service/ https://fastmail.blog/historical/shutting-down-our-xmpp-chat...) and probably for the same reason won't get into Matrix.
  - jakecopp 5y ago
    > For intra-business messaging, most companies seem to be sticking with proven multi-user protocols like IRC rather than XMPP Multi-User Chat (MUC), or are moving to more sophisticated proprietary collaboration platforms like Slack. That sounds true as of 2015, however Matrix now has a large following in open source & in some governments & businesses. I can't find a list of orgs using Matrix but that would be interesting to see.
- hardwaresofton 5y ago
  Yeah, it might be a hard sell compared to GApps for most businesses but I'd like to think there are is a subset that would want the F/OSS solution! I wonder if bundling FF Send would also be useful, see there's a filelink provider for that as well which is interesting.
- pid-1 5y ago
  Unfortunately matrix is a no go for regulated business (read: you might be required to monitor employees and hand over chats to govt.)
  - ryukafalz 5y ago
    If need be, you can require the use of a Matrix client that doesn’t support end to end encryption, or has support for it disabled. Nothing stopping you from doing that, almost all the clients are FOSS.
    - mycall 5y ago
      Or add a keylogger/eventstore into the Matrix client.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
    - rovr138 5y ago
      Even if End to End encrypted, the client has access to the decrypted content and could log it.
  - aspenmayer 5y ago
    There is some development in that area. This is from an Element dev, apparently. Not sure if this is very up to date as it’s from about a year ago, but it seems highly topical. https://brendan.abolivier.bzh/matrix-retention-policies/ https://brendan.abolivier.bzh/matrix-retention-policies/ https://github.com/matrix-org/synapse/blob/develop/docs/message_retention_policies.md https://github.com/matrix-org/synapse/blob/develop/docs/mess...
  - Arathorn 5y ago
    Matrix development is mainly funded by providing deployments for regulated business(!) - ie the French state, German armed forces, UK government, DOD etc. If you search for “audit bot” in https://element.io/enterprise/pricing#features https://element.io/enterprise/pricing#features you’ll see all the stuff available for enterprisey deployments from Element.
- Jiocus 5y ago
  Just add some LDAP services for identity management, authentication and it's fairly close to the project I'm on right now. A cursory look at getting a matrix server running didn't work out yet though, with issues for clients to recognise the server at all. I don't mind sysops work but right now a set&forget solution would spare some needed energy. The Thunderbird+Matrix integration sounds like a match - I hope that holds up in practice as well! Edit: as others mentioned, Nextcloud has the features.
  - rglullis 5y ago
    Do you mind if I send you an email? I am looking for people/companies that might be interested in having a managed matrix provider.
- rglullis 5y ago
  May I interest you in Matrix (and/or XMPP) for messaging and Mastodon (for social media) on Communick[0]? I've done some experiments with running an email server as well, but I don't think I would be able to run it as reliably and cost-effectively as the more established players. > replacing Slack/Teams for internal comms Also, Mastodon (or Pleroma) can work as a substitute for Yammer. [0] https://communick.com https://communick.com
dflock 5y ago
NextCloud does all that, I think?
qbasic_forever 5y ago
NextCloud is what I think of when I think of self hosting a webdav, caldav, etc. setup.
- hardwaresofton 5y ago
  Ahhh but I wasn’t thinking of quite self Hosting but a managed service… do businesses use Nextcloud in that way I wonder.
  - captn3m0 5y ago
    There are managed NextCloud hosts. https://nextcloud.com/providers/ https://nextcloud.com/providers/
  - emptysongglass 5y ago
    Hetzner offers this [1]. For less than 5 EUR a month you get 1 TB of storage plus their managed Nextcloud! [1] https://www.hetzner.com/storage/storage-share https://www.hetzner.com/storage/storage-share
    - indigodaddy 5y ago
      Hi I went through the faq and it wasn’t mentioned, but does the “storage share powered by nextcloud” Hetzner service, include all the other features of nextcloud as well like chat, etc?
      - emptysongglass 5y ago
        I last used it at a start-up a few years ago (I self-host everything now) so my memory is a bit hazy but yes, I remember the option at that time to add and enable any apps you wanted available from Nextcloud's app catalog.
      - RcrdBrt 5y ago
        Yes, it does
      - 5y ago
rglullis 5y ago
How much would you be willing to pay for it? I provide Matrix hosting (as well as XMPP and ActivityPub Mastodon) on Communick [0]. At the moment I'm more focused on taking these services to offer custom domain hosting, and personally I've been staying away from servers and using DecSync [1] + syncthing to get my calendars and contacts on my devices [2], so I haven't thought about adding a DAV server to the mix on Communick. But if you tell me there is any actual demand, I would definitely consider it. [0] https://communick.com https://communick.com [1] https://github.com/39aldo39/DecSync https://github.com/39aldo39/DecSync [2] https://raphael.lullis.net/thinking-heads-are-not-in-the-clouds/ https://raphael.lullis.net/thinking-heads-are-not-in-the-clo...
- hardwaresofton 5y ago
  I was about to ask the same thing -- I run a service that offers DAV and was wondering if I should add CalDAV and CardDAV (I've been wanting to do it for a while) and offered this bundled service... You might want to send that question jakecopp 's way though! :)
  - rglullis 5y ago
    Oh, so you are the guy from Vadosware? That's cool, I really liked your idea of using AirTable to power the landing page of your site.
    - hardwaresofton 5y ago
      Oh I am -- thanks for visiting the site! -- it was Baserow[0] and since then I've actually finally gotten a chance to try out NocoDB[1][2] as well! I'm a heavy Thunderbird (+ maddy[3]) user, and have been wondering lately if I'm missing anything by not having CardDAV/CalDAV [0]: https://baserow.io/ https://baserow.io/ [1]: https://nocodb.com/ https://nocodb.com/ [2]: https://nomorepizzaparties.com/accounting.html https://nomorepizzaparties.com/accounting.html [3]: https://foxcpp.dev/maddy/ https://foxcpp.dev/maddy/
agilob 5y ago
>The crossover I never knew I wanted but am glad to see You can also use IRC and XMPP in Thunderbird.

jakecopp 5y ago

I haven't heard of anyone that hosts both Matrix & Mail/Calendar/Contacts. That would be a really interesting enterprise solution though - effectively replacing Slack/Teams for internal comms!

dflock 5y ago
NextCloud does all this, afaik.
pmw 5y ago
Fastmail has been that all-in solution. They host Mail/Calendar/Contacts, and they used to host XMPP/Jabber. But unfortunately they made the decision to shut down XMPP (https://fastmail.blog/historical/shutting-down-our-xmpp-chat-service/ https://fastmail.blog/historical/shutting-down-our-xmpp-chat...) and probably for the same reason won't get into Matrix.
- jakecopp 5y ago
  > For intra-business messaging, most companies seem to be sticking with proven multi-user protocols like IRC rather than XMPP Multi-User Chat (MUC), or are moving to more sophisticated proprietary collaboration platforms like Slack. That sounds true as of 2015, however Matrix now has a large following in open source & in some governments & businesses. I can't find a list of orgs using Matrix but that would be interesting to see.
hardwaresofton 5y ago
Yeah, it might be a hard sell compared to GApps for most businesses but I'd like to think there are is a subset that would want the F/OSS solution! I wonder if bundling FF Send would also be useful, see there's a filelink provider for that as well which is interesting.
pid-1 5y ago
Unfortunately matrix is a no go for regulated business (read: you might be required to monitor employees and hand over chats to govt.)
- ryukafalz 5y ago
  If need be, you can require the use of a Matrix client that doesn’t support end to end encryption, or has support for it disabled. Nothing stopping you from doing that, almost all the clients are FOSS.
  - mycall 5y ago
    Or add a keylogger/eventstore into the Matrix client.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
  - rovr138 5y ago
    Even if End to End encrypted, the client has access to the decrypted content and could log it.
- aspenmayer 5y ago
  There is some development in that area. This is from an Element dev, apparently. Not sure if this is very up to date as it’s from about a year ago, but it seems highly topical. https://brendan.abolivier.bzh/matrix-retention-policies/ https://brendan.abolivier.bzh/matrix-retention-policies/ https://github.com/matrix-org/synapse/blob/develop/docs/message_retention_policies.md https://github.com/matrix-org/synapse/blob/develop/docs/mess...
- Arathorn 5y ago
  Matrix development is mainly funded by providing deployments for regulated business(!) - ie the French state, German armed forces, UK government, DOD etc. If you search for “audit bot” in https://element.io/enterprise/pricing#features https://element.io/enterprise/pricing#features you’ll see all the stuff available for enterprisey deployments from Element.
Jiocus 5y ago
Just add some LDAP services for identity management, authentication and it's fairly close to the project I'm on right now. A cursory look at getting a matrix server running didn't work out yet though, with issues for clients to recognise the server at all. I don't mind sysops work but right now a set&forget solution would spare some needed energy. The Thunderbird+Matrix integration sounds like a match - I hope that holds up in practice as well! Edit: as others mentioned, Nextcloud has the features.
- rglullis 5y ago
  Do you mind if I send you an email? I am looking for people/companies that might be interested in having a managed matrix provider.
rglullis 5y ago
May I interest you in Matrix (and/or XMPP) for messaging and Mastodon (for social media) on Communick[0]? I've done some experiments with running an email server as well, but I don't think I would be able to run it as reliably and cost-effectively as the more established players. > replacing Slack/Teams for internal comms Also, Mastodon (or Pleroma) can work as a substitute for Yammer. [0] https://communick.com https://communick.com

dflock 5y ago

NextCloud does all that, I think?

qbasic_forever 5y ago

NextCloud is what I think of when I think of self hosting a webdav, caldav, etc. setup.

hardwaresofton 5y ago
Ahhh but I wasn’t thinking of quite self Hosting but a managed service… do businesses use Nextcloud in that way I wonder.
- captn3m0 5y ago
  There are managed NextCloud hosts. https://nextcloud.com/providers/ https://nextcloud.com/providers/
- emptysongglass 5y ago
  Hetzner offers this [1]. For less than 5 EUR a month you get 1 TB of storage plus their managed Nextcloud! [1] https://www.hetzner.com/storage/storage-share https://www.hetzner.com/storage/storage-share
  - indigodaddy 5y ago
    Hi I went through the faq and it wasn’t mentioned, but does the “storage share powered by nextcloud” Hetzner service, include all the other features of nextcloud as well like chat, etc?
    - emptysongglass 5y ago
      I last used it at a start-up a few years ago (I self-host everything now) so my memory is a bit hazy but yes, I remember the option at that time to add and enable any apps you wanted available from Nextcloud's app catalog.
    - RcrdBrt 5y ago
      Yes, it does
    - 5y ago

rglullis 5y ago

How much would you be willing to pay for it? I provide Matrix hosting (as well as XMPP and ActivityPub Mastodon) on Communick [0]. At the moment I'm more focused on taking these services to offer custom domain hosting, and personally I've been staying away from servers and using DecSync [1] + syncthing to get my calendars and contacts on my devices [2], so I haven't thought about adding a DAV server to the mix on Communick. But if you tell me there is any actual demand, I would definitely consider it. [0] https://communick.com https://communick.com [1] https://github.com/39aldo39/DecSync https://github.com/39aldo39/DecSync [2] https://raphael.lullis.net/thinking-heads-are-not-in-the-clouds/ https://raphael.lullis.net/thinking-heads-are-not-in-the-clo...

hardwaresofton 5y ago
I was about to ask the same thing -- I run a service that offers DAV and was wondering if I should add CalDAV and CardDAV (I've been wanting to do it for a while) and offered this bundled service... You might want to send that question jakecopp 's way though! :)
- rglullis 5y ago
  Oh, so you are the guy from Vadosware? That's cool, I really liked your idea of using AirTable to power the landing page of your site.
  - hardwaresofton 5y ago
    Oh I am -- thanks for visiting the site! -- it was Baserow[0] and since then I've actually finally gotten a chance to try out NocoDB[1][2] as well! I'm a heavy Thunderbird (+ maddy[3]) user, and have been wondering lately if I'm missing anything by not having CardDAV/CalDAV [0]: https://baserow.io/ https://baserow.io/ [1]: https://nocodb.com/ https://nocodb.com/ [2]: https://nomorepizzaparties.com/accounting.html https://nomorepizzaparties.com/accounting.html [3]: https://foxcpp.dev/maddy/ https://foxcpp.dev/maddy/

agilob 5y ago

>The crossover I never knew I wanted but am glad to see You can also use IRC and XMPP in Thunderbird.