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I hope he doesn't. It sounds like your customer service is the usual cost-minimization nightmare, and I don't see how fixing this one case will make it any bet

I hope he doesn't. It sounds like your customer service is the usual cost-minimization nightmare, and I don't see how fixing this one case will make it any better. Companies like yours make it hard for customers to reach capable representatives and routinely break service promises. Because hey! who cares if we have treated people decently? it has nothing to do with the business model. There must be dozens of ways to ensure your customer service systems treat people properly, and you're clearly doing none of them. Don't fix this case, fix your systems.

tehlike 5y ago
You should notice that a CEO may not necessarily be aware of everything going on, and cases like this might trigger a deeper look on his side. Whether affirm has this kind of issues as a pattern or not, i don't know. But assuming malintent is not a great pov imho.
- uoaei 5y ago
  > a CEO may not necessarily be aware of everything going on "Everything" in the micro sense, sure. "Everything" in the macro sense, well, that's literally the job description of CEO, so it sounds like you think the CEO does not deserve criticism. If customer service is not working to the benefit of customers, I'd say that's something a CEO should already be aware of and represents a lack in organizational awareness, which compromises executive duties. Just because the job is hard doesn't mean we should give anyone a break. Assuming the role and responsibilities of CEO is completely voluntary. I don't think anyone is assuming malice; intent has nothing to do with this. The outcome of each interaction is only what matters here.
  - tehlike 5y ago
    You are making plenty of assumptions. But let's entertain what you said is true. What if this is a recent regression that even his people (c-level, vp level etc) is trying to solve recently? Assuming CEO has visibility into every macro thing(who decides what is macro?) at any given point in time is not fair, especially these days when there is so much economic volatility to be honest, which impacts his company more than many others. He doesn't get a pass because he is the CEO. I believe him to be a decent humble person, that will make a honest attempt to address this specific problem and at large. That's all.
senko 5y ago
>> Please email me [...] it will help us prevent poor customer experiences. > I hope he doesn't. [...] Don't fix this case, fix your systems. He's literally trying to do exactly that (and acknowledged the customer is pissed and likely can't be bothered to). How would you hande this situation? Not the hypothetical "I'd never let this happen", because if you haven't given at least someone a bad customer experience, you didn't have customers.
- chernevik 5y ago
  I would send them an email at the address listed in their HN profile (it's there, I checked). I would NOT respond to a complaint like this on Hacker News with some performative demonstration of concern. I would ask my VP for customer service to explain the state of the operation and why this case is such a mess. Who knows, maybe they aren't getting adequate resources or support. I'd do a deep dive: - What are our average call hold times? standard deviations? what is our response to outliers? - How do we QC these calls? - When we promise to contact a customer, what is our average response time? standard deviations? what is our response to outliers? - How do we QC the quality of those responses? - What are our escalation procedures? How often / effectively are they invoked? - What is our track record with credit bureau reports -- how often are they challenged? what is the outcome of those challenges? - What is our plan for customer service? How do we know it is properly resourced? I'd expect answers to these questions in a day or so, if they can't answer these quickly they aren't the right person. I would be preparing to tell my board, subject to the answers received above, that we have serious problems in customer support, we need new leadership/strategy there, and this might be expensive. These are the guesses of a zero-management experience dude. I'm sure a real CEO would have a better list -- but they should be doing something serious about problems that are clearly systematic.
  - tehlike 5y ago
    Something can be both performative, and honest at the same time. He probably got notified by someone in the company that this is getting attention, he felt responsible so he responded AND got people to pull numbers for example.
arcastroe 5y ago
> I hope he doesnt. I personally find Max's (CEO's) response great, and his direct reply and personal note/care is one of the best possible outcomes in this situation. I wouldn't want to discourage this kind of response.
AmericanOP 5y ago
The only appropriate response is a public flogging. I also hope he validates my cynicism rather than solve the problem.

tehlike 5y ago

You should notice that a CEO may not necessarily be aware of everything going on, and cases like this might trigger a deeper look on his side. Whether affirm has this kind of issues as a pattern or not, i don't know. But assuming malintent is not a great pov imho.

uoaei 5y ago
> a CEO may not necessarily be aware of everything going on "Everything" in the micro sense, sure. "Everything" in the macro sense, well, that's literally the job description of CEO, so it sounds like you think the CEO does not deserve criticism. If customer service is not working to the benefit of customers, I'd say that's something a CEO should already be aware of and represents a lack in organizational awareness, which compromises executive duties. Just because the job is hard doesn't mean we should give anyone a break. Assuming the role and responsibilities of CEO is completely voluntary. I don't think anyone is assuming malice; intent has nothing to do with this. The outcome of each interaction is only what matters here.
- tehlike 5y ago
  You are making plenty of assumptions. But let's entertain what you said is true. What if this is a recent regression that even his people (c-level, vp level etc) is trying to solve recently? Assuming CEO has visibility into every macro thing(who decides what is macro?) at any given point in time is not fair, especially these days when there is so much economic volatility to be honest, which impacts his company more than many others. He doesn't get a pass because he is the CEO. I believe him to be a decent humble person, that will make a honest attempt to address this specific problem and at large. That's all.

senko 5y ago

>> Please email me [...] it will help us prevent poor customer experiences. > I hope he doesn't. [...] Don't fix this case, fix your systems. He's literally trying to do exactly that (and acknowledged the customer is pissed and likely can't be bothered to). How would you hande this situation? Not the hypothetical "I'd never let this happen", because if you haven't given at least someone a bad customer experience, you didn't have customers.

chernevik 5y ago
I would send them an email at the address listed in their HN profile (it's there, I checked). I would NOT respond to a complaint like this on Hacker News with some performative demonstration of concern. I would ask my VP for customer service to explain the state of the operation and why this case is such a mess. Who knows, maybe they aren't getting adequate resources or support. I'd do a deep dive: - What are our average call hold times? standard deviations? what is our response to outliers? - How do we QC these calls? - When we promise to contact a customer, what is our average response time? standard deviations? what is our response to outliers? - How do we QC the quality of those responses? - What are our escalation procedures? How often / effectively are they invoked? - What is our track record with credit bureau reports -- how often are they challenged? what is the outcome of those challenges? - What is our plan for customer service? How do we know it is properly resourced? I'd expect answers to these questions in a day or so, if they can't answer these quickly they aren't the right person. I would be preparing to tell my board, subject to the answers received above, that we have serious problems in customer support, we need new leadership/strategy there, and this might be expensive. These are the guesses of a zero-management experience dude. I'm sure a real CEO would have a better list -- but they should be doing something serious about problems that are clearly systematic.
- tehlike 5y ago
  Something can be both performative, and honest at the same time. He probably got notified by someone in the company that this is getting attention, he felt responsible so he responded AND got people to pull numbers for example.

arcastroe 5y ago

> I hope he doesnt. I personally find Max's (CEO's) response great, and his direct reply and personal note/care is one of the best possible outcomes in this situation. I wouldn't want to discourage this kind of response.

AmericanOP 5y ago

The only appropriate response is a public flogging. I also hope he validates my cynicism rather than solve the problem.