6 ms·

It's funny how much PR gets done by this company that Musk says doesn't do PR or have a PR department.

revscat 5y ago
This gets brought up every time. Tesla has never said they don’t do marketing, or have a PR department. They have said they don’t advertise. If you have evidence saying otherwise please do share.
- clouddrover 5y ago
  > They have said they don’t advertise. Then they lied. This video is an ad. Here's another Tesla ad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9id7BSPttGs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9id7BSPttGs And here's another Tesla ad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uz394aKhfLY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uz394aKhfLY
  - trixie_ 5y ago
    Oh you're right, how much do you think they paid to broadcast those advertisements?
    - clouddrover 5y ago
      How much do you think they paid to make those advertisements?
      - tempestn 5y ago
        They paid for this marketing, obviously, but by definition an ad is a paid placement.
        clouddrover 5y ago
        It's an ad, plain and simple. Here's some more advertising. Tesla offers you the exciting opportunity of a religious experience at a live infomercial: https://www.inputmag.com/culture/tesla-cyber-rodeo-rabid-elon-musk-cult-gigafactory-cybertruck-model-y-electric-vehicles https://www.inputmag.com/culture/tesla-cyber-rodeo-rabid-elo...
        heavyset_go 5y ago
        This is revisionism and just plain wrong. From OED: > a notice or announcement in a public medium promoting a product, service, or event or publicizing a job vacancy. From Merriam-Webster: > a public notice especially : one published in the press or broadcast over the air
        zaroth 5y ago
        The MW definition is obviously wrong, it vaguely describes every piece of text on the Internet.
        clouddrover 5y ago
        Sure. It's the dictionary that's got it wrong. The mental gymnastics Tesla fans perform to desperately rationalize Tesla's obvious lies ought to be an Olympic sport. Tesla advertises. Accept it. Embrace the reality of it.
        tempestn 5y ago
        I'm no Tesla fan, but I maintain that the standard understanding of an "advertisement" implies paid. Just because a company puts something out there into the world doesn't make it an advertisement. (Things like classified job posting "ads" notwithstanding.)
        clouddrover 5y ago
        That's nothing to be embarrassed about. You're wrong, that's all. This kind of silly semantic argument is both weak and tedious. They're ads, start to finish. It's advertising. There is no other honest description.
        tempestn 5y ago
        Is that kind of hostile/dismissive language actually necessary or helpful do you think? What if instead we investigate the disagreement in good faith? One of the two definitions of an "advertisement" from Webster was quoted. The other is this: > the act or process of advertising something Which links to "advertising": > the action of calling something to the attention of the public especially by paid announcements Emphasis mine. So perhaps we have some middle ground here. I would argue that this is the advertising definition we're talking about when we're discussing whether something is an "advertisement", not the sort of public event or job posting, commonly referred to as a "classified ad", referred to by the other definition. Maybe that's where we disagree. Or maybe it's the salience of this "especially by paid announcements". In my experience, that is the general understanding of the term: advertisements are generally paid. But I acknowledge that it says "especially by", not "only by", so some room for interpretation is left. So, given all that, I figure if you want to label this an ad, that's reasonable. What I find less reasonable is declaring anyone who disagrees to be objectively wrong, and then using dismissive language like the above to try and win an unnecessary argument.
      - epgui 5y ago
        You guys are all debating different things and talking past each other.
        clouddrover 5y ago
        No, it's all very simple. There's what's true and there's what's false. What's false: Tesla doesn't advertise. What's true: Tesla advertises. See? Simple.
        trixie_ 5y ago
        Pedantic. (Almost) Everyone understands what 'Tesla doesn't advertise' means.
        rootusrootus 5y ago
        But everyone also recognizes this video as the ad that it is.
  - reducesuffering 5y ago
    I think most peoples' definition is clearly about "push-based" paid advertising, rather than "pull-based" marketing videos that they don't pay any platform to promote. I for one, am grateful that a company is showing the power of organic marketing like that, as opposed to constantly having to see Doritos ads injected into my friends' Instagram stories on iOS. (jk, I only use desktop Firefox w/ uBlock now)
    - clouddrover 5y ago
      > I think most peoples' definition is clearly about "push-based" paid advertising That's got nothing to do with it. All that's going on here is that people have bought into a false narrative that Tesla doesn't do advertising. And instead of recognizing it as false they desperately defend the falsehood to avoid feeling foolish. Making the claim that something which is plainly an ad is not an ad by way of silly semantics is farcical.
      - revscat 5y ago
        Not an ad.
        clouddrover 5y ago
        To help you, here are some dictionary definitions of "advertisement". Oxford (https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/advertisement https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/advertisement): "A notice or announcement in a public medium promoting a product, service, or event or publicizing a job vacancy." Merriam Webster (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/advertisement https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/advertisement): "a public notice, especially: one published in the press or broadcast over the air" Collins (https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/advertisement https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/adverti...): "An advertisement is an announcement online, or in a newspaper, on television, or on a poster about something such as a product, event, or job." Cambridge (https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/advertisement https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/advertis...): "a picture, short film, song, etc. that tries to persuade people to buy a product or service, or a piece of text that tells people about a job, etc." You've naively bought into a lie that Tesla has told you but that doesn't mean you need to keep repeating that lie.
- maven29 5y ago
  https://www.prdaily.com/what-teslas-move-to-eliminate-its-pr-department-means-for-the-industry/ https://www.prdaily.com/what-teslas-move-to-eliminate-its-pr... https://jalopnik.com/teslas-pr-department-hasnt-responded-to-me-for-months-a-1845279798 https://jalopnik.com/teslas-pr-department-hasnt-responded-to... The fact that they don't have a press office at all?
panick21_ 5y ago
What Musk actually says is that they don't do advertisement and that case by the comment definition of 'paying somebody to run ads'. As far as I know, please provide sources if you know otherwise, that Musk or Tesla said 'we don't have a PR department'. Rather the media around Tesla stopped getting answers for requests and some of the personal contacts from inside Tesla that they had left the company. This lead the media concluding that Tesla had fired its PR department. Or at least those people that responded to media requests. We know that some people that were part of that moved to other position inside Tesla. Tesla always had events and produced various kinds of media that they put out on their own channel. They clearly have a marketing or media team of some kind. The also clearly have people preparing communication for governments and shareholders, so they do have some kind of PR department, even if they internally don't call it that and those people work inside other departments. I think you are mixing up what Musk claims and what media companies say about Tesla.
- heavyset_go 5y ago
  > Musk or Tesla said 'we don't have a PR department'. From an article titled "Elon Musk says no to a new Tesla PR department, doesn’t believe ‘manipulating public opinion’"[1]: > Elon Musk rejected the idea of Tesla going back to having a PR department, and his reasoning behind it is quite revealing: He doesn’t believe in “manipulating public opinion.” [1] https://electrek.co/2021/04/28/elon-musk-no-new-tesla-pr-department-manipulating-public-opinion/amp/ https://electrek.co/2021/04/28/elon-musk-no-new-tesla-pr-dep...
  - panick21_ 5y ago
    Other companies spend money on advertising & manipulating public opinion, Tesla focuses on the product. I trust the people. — Elon Musk (@elonmusk) April 27, 2021 That's the actual quote and the question was from a media member who used to have a lot of contact with the PR team and was referring to people responding to requests from him. Fred knows very well that Tesla still has a marketing team in general.
- manquer 5y ago
  - PR - handling traditional and perhaps social media channels like TV, journals, magazines etc answer press questions, arrange interviews , make sure journalists covering them have access, in smaller orgs get journalist to cover them. - media planning - figures out where to place advertisements and when and may handle also the buy operations . Digital is in-house in large orgs, but for traditional media like print it is external[1] - creative agencies usually external and produce advertising content like Super Bowl ads to boring flyers - Marcom - Marketing communications usually is responsible for Corporate communication and content that is not advertising stuff like this video. - few other like lobbying ,crisis control etc may work in the same group or work with legal or other depts Tesla seems to have other three depts in some form, they did say they fire PR team and stopped engaging with traditional press ——- [1] this still requires relationship building unlike digital as there is no targeting , limited inches airtime available and getting the slots you want can be tricky everyone wants best prime time /first page etc for their campaigns, it is not always top price sale. As slots are sold in complex packages clubbed with less attractive media properties that don’t sell as well with the attractive ones you do want to buy . This is why we have media groups they are more efficient, as they can better monetize properties by clubbing them in sales and are able to acquire independent publications/channels to make more money than they were making on their own.
rootusrootus 5y ago
It works wonderfully, too. Look how many people in this thread are just now realizing how incredibly automated manufacturing has become; they think Tesla invented all this.

This gets brought up every time. Tesla has never said they don’t do marketing, or have a PR department. They have said they don’t advertise. If you have evidence saying otherwise please do share.

clouddrover 5y ago
> They have said they don’t advertise. Then they lied. This video is an ad. Here's another Tesla ad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9id7BSPttGs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9id7BSPttGs And here's another Tesla ad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uz394aKhfLY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uz394aKhfLY
- trixie_ 5y ago
  Oh you're right, how much do you think they paid to broadcast those advertisements?
  - clouddrover 5y ago
    How much do you think they paid to make those advertisements?
    - tempestn 5y ago
      They paid for this marketing, obviously, but by definition an ad is a paid placement.
      - clouddrover 5y ago
        It's an ad, plain and simple. Here's some more advertising. Tesla offers you the exciting opportunity of a religious experience at a live infomercial: https://www.inputmag.com/culture/tesla-cyber-rodeo-rabid-elon-musk-cult-gigafactory-cybertruck-model-y-electric-vehicles https://www.inputmag.com/culture/tesla-cyber-rodeo-rabid-elo...
      - heavyset_go 5y ago
        This is revisionism and just plain wrong. From OED: > a notice or announcement in a public medium promoting a product, service, or event or publicizing a job vacancy. From Merriam-Webster: > a public notice especially : one published in the press or broadcast over the air
        zaroth 5y ago
        The MW definition is obviously wrong, it vaguely describes every piece of text on the Internet.
        clouddrover 5y ago
        Sure. It's the dictionary that's got it wrong. The mental gymnastics Tesla fans perform to desperately rationalize Tesla's obvious lies ought to be an Olympic sport. Tesla advertises. Accept it. Embrace the reality of it.
        tempestn 5y ago
        I'm no Tesla fan, but I maintain that the standard understanding of an "advertisement" implies paid. Just because a company puts something out there into the world doesn't make it an advertisement. (Things like classified job posting "ads" notwithstanding.)
        clouddrover 5y ago
        That's nothing to be embarrassed about. You're wrong, that's all. This kind of silly semantic argument is both weak and tedious. They're ads, start to finish. It's advertising. There is no other honest description.
        tempestn 5y ago
        Is that kind of hostile/dismissive language actually necessary or helpful do you think? What if instead we investigate the disagreement in good faith? One of the two definitions of an "advertisement" from Webster was quoted. The other is this: > the act or process of advertising something Which links to "advertising": > the action of calling something to the attention of the public especially by paid announcements Emphasis mine. So perhaps we have some middle ground here. I would argue that this is the advertising definition we're talking about when we're discussing whether something is an "advertisement", not the sort of public event or job posting, commonly referred to as a "classified ad", referred to by the other definition. Maybe that's where we disagree. Or maybe it's the salience of this "especially by paid announcements". In my experience, that is the general understanding of the term: advertisements are generally paid. But I acknowledge that it says "especially by", not "only by", so some room for interpretation is left. So, given all that, I figure if you want to label this an ad, that's reasonable. What I find less reasonable is declaring anyone who disagrees to be objectively wrong, and then using dismissive language like the above to try and win an unnecessary argument.
    - epgui 5y ago
      You guys are all debating different things and talking past each other.
      - clouddrover 5y ago
        No, it's all very simple. There's what's true and there's what's false. What's false: Tesla doesn't advertise. What's true: Tesla advertises. See? Simple.
        trixie_ 5y ago
        Pedantic. (Almost) Everyone understands what 'Tesla doesn't advertise' means.
        rootusrootus 5y ago
        But everyone also recognizes this video as the ad that it is.
- reducesuffering 5y ago
  I think most peoples' definition is clearly about "push-based" paid advertising, rather than "pull-based" marketing videos that they don't pay any platform to promote. I for one, am grateful that a company is showing the power of organic marketing like that, as opposed to constantly having to see Doritos ads injected into my friends' Instagram stories on iOS. (jk, I only use desktop Firefox w/ uBlock now)
  - clouddrover 5y ago
    > I think most peoples' definition is clearly about "push-based" paid advertising That's got nothing to do with it. All that's going on here is that people have bought into a false narrative that Tesla doesn't do advertising. And instead of recognizing it as false they desperately defend the falsehood to avoid feeling foolish. Making the claim that something which is plainly an ad is not an ad by way of silly semantics is farcical.
    - revscat 5y ago
      Not an ad.
      - clouddrover 5y ago
        To help you, here are some dictionary definitions of "advertisement". Oxford (https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/advertisement https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/advertisement): "A notice or announcement in a public medium promoting a product, service, or event or publicizing a job vacancy." Merriam Webster (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/advertisement https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/advertisement): "a public notice, especially: one published in the press or broadcast over the air" Collins (https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/advertisement https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/adverti...): "An advertisement is an announcement online, or in a newspaper, on television, or on a poster about something such as a product, event, or job." Cambridge (https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/advertisement https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/advertis...): "a picture, short film, song, etc. that tries to persuade people to buy a product or service, or a piece of text that tells people about a job, etc." You've naively bought into a lie that Tesla has told you but that doesn't mean you need to keep repeating that lie.
maven29 5y ago
https://www.prdaily.com/what-teslas-move-to-eliminate-its-pr-department-means-for-the-industry/ https://www.prdaily.com/what-teslas-move-to-eliminate-its-pr... https://jalopnik.com/teslas-pr-department-hasnt-responded-to-me-for-months-a-1845279798 https://jalopnik.com/teslas-pr-department-hasnt-responded-to... The fact that they don't have a press office at all?

panick21_ 5y ago

What Musk actually says is that they don't do advertisement and that case by the comment definition of 'paying somebody to run ads'. As far as I know, please provide sources if you know otherwise, that Musk or Tesla said 'we don't have a PR department'. Rather the media around Tesla stopped getting answers for requests and some of the personal contacts from inside Tesla that they had left the company. This lead the media concluding that Tesla had fired its PR department. Or at least those people that responded to media requests. We know that some people that were part of that moved to other position inside Tesla. Tesla always had events and produced various kinds of media that they put out on their own channel. They clearly have a marketing or media team of some kind. The also clearly have people preparing communication for governments and shareholders, so they do have some kind of PR department, even if they internally don't call it that and those people work inside other departments. I think you are mixing up what Musk claims and what media companies say about Tesla.

heavyset_go 5y ago
> Musk or Tesla said 'we don't have a PR department'. From an article titled "Elon Musk says no to a new Tesla PR department, doesn’t believe ‘manipulating public opinion’"[1]: > Elon Musk rejected the idea of Tesla going back to having a PR department, and his reasoning behind it is quite revealing: He doesn’t believe in “manipulating public opinion.” [1] https://electrek.co/2021/04/28/elon-musk-no-new-tesla-pr-department-manipulating-public-opinion/amp/ https://electrek.co/2021/04/28/elon-musk-no-new-tesla-pr-dep...
- panick21_ 5y ago
  Other companies spend money on advertising & manipulating public opinion, Tesla focuses on the product. I trust the people. — Elon Musk (@elonmusk) April 27, 2021 That's the actual quote and the question was from a media member who used to have a lot of contact with the PR team and was referring to people responding to requests from him. Fred knows very well that Tesla still has a marketing team in general.
manquer 5y ago
- PR - handling traditional and perhaps social media channels like TV, journals, magazines etc answer press questions, arrange interviews , make sure journalists covering them have access, in smaller orgs get journalist to cover them. - media planning - figures out where to place advertisements and when and may handle also the buy operations . Digital is in-house in large orgs, but for traditional media like print it is external[1] - creative agencies usually external and produce advertising content like Super Bowl ads to boring flyers - Marcom - Marketing communications usually is responsible for Corporate communication and content that is not advertising stuff like this video. - few other like lobbying ,crisis control etc may work in the same group or work with legal or other depts Tesla seems to have other three depts in some form, they did say they fire PR team and stopped engaging with traditional press ——- [1] this still requires relationship building unlike digital as there is no targeting , limited inches airtime available and getting the slots you want can be tricky everyone wants best prime time /first page etc for their campaigns, it is not always top price sale. As slots are sold in complex packages clubbed with less attractive media properties that don’t sell as well with the attractive ones you do want to buy . This is why we have media groups they are more efficient, as they can better monetize properties by clubbing them in sales and are able to acquire independent publications/channels to make more money than they were making on their own.

rootusrootus 5y ago

It works wonderfully, too. Look how many people in this thread are just now realizing how incredibly automated manufacturing has become; they think Tesla invented all this.