5 ms·

Some pthalates seem to be detectable to some subset of the population. Same chemicals that are estrogen-alike.

by R0b0t1 5y ago

stephen_g 5y ago
Why would milk containers have phthalates in them? All ours here in Australia are made with HDPE which doesn't need plasticisers. Although I have read that apparently a fair proportion of milk in the US is made with equipment that uses PVC piping that leeches phthalates before it's even packaged...
- kurthr 5y ago
  It's similar in the US. I'd note that even the crystal clear (highly recyclable) plastic you see does not contain the phthalates you're looking for. There was a fad in the early 00s for using polycarbonate water bottles that probably contained BPA, but those were then (rightfully) banned. You can't even use BPA or ortho-phthalates in children's toys since they very likely put them in their tiny mouths. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1367856/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1367856/
  - R0b0t1 5y ago
    Plastics still need a plasticizer, so those BPA-free plastics simply use a chemical like BPA but not studied.
    - kurthr 5y ago
      I don't know about PolyCarobonate, but for LDPE and HDPE (and PET) that sounds incorrect. Certainly, chemists are worried about much smaller amounts of contamination (ppb) than humans and they would definitely know (and measure) how much plasticizer was leaching from their bottles. It appears to be almost none: https://www.thermofisher.com/us/en/home/life-science/lab-plasticware-supplies/plastic-material-selection/low-density-polyethylene-ldpe-labware.html https://www.thermofisher.com/us/en/home/life-science/lab-pla...
      - R0b0t1 5y ago
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bisphenol_A#BPA_substitutes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bisphenol_A#BPA_substitutes I know there's wide variety in plastics. Be careful about cherry picking studies that show no harm, you can do it with lead if you really want. The situation isn't as dire, but I think the actual impact on animals is more up in the air than a brief survey of the literature suggests.
        kurthr 5y ago
        Perhaps, but none of the plastics we're discussing (other than PC) have BPA in them at detectable amounts.

Some pthalates seem to be detectable to some subset of the population. Same chemicals that are estrogen-alike.

by R0b0t1 5y ago

Some pthalates seem to be detectable to some subset of the population. Same chemicals that are estrogen-alike.

Why would milk containers have phthalates in them? All ours here in Australia are made with HDPE which doesn't need plasticisers. Although I have read that apparently a fair proportion of milk in the US is made with equipment that uses PVC piping that leeches phthalates before it's even packaged...

kurthr 5y ago
It's similar in the US. I'd note that even the crystal clear (highly recyclable) plastic you see does not contain the phthalates you're looking for. There was a fad in the early 00s for using polycarbonate water bottles that probably contained BPA, but those were then (rightfully) banned. You can't even use BPA or ortho-phthalates in children's toys since they very likely put them in their tiny mouths. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1367856/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1367856/
- R0b0t1 5y ago
  Plastics still need a plasticizer, so those BPA-free plastics simply use a chemical like BPA but not studied.
  - kurthr 5y ago
    I don't know about PolyCarobonate, but for LDPE and HDPE (and PET) that sounds incorrect. Certainly, chemists are worried about much smaller amounts of contamination (ppb) than humans and they would definitely know (and measure) how much plasticizer was leaching from their bottles. It appears to be almost none: https://www.thermofisher.com/us/en/home/life-science/lab-plasticware-supplies/plastic-material-selection/low-density-polyethylene-ldpe-labware.html https://www.thermofisher.com/us/en/home/life-science/lab-pla...
    - R0b0t1 5y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bisphenol_A#BPA_substitutes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bisphenol_A#BPA_substitutes I know there's wide variety in plastics. Be careful about cherry picking studies that show no harm, you can do it with lead if you really want. The situation isn't as dire, but I think the actual impact on animals is more up in the air than a brief survey of the literature suggests.
      - kurthr 5y ago
        Perhaps, but none of the plastics we're discussing (other than PC) have BPA in them at detectable amounts.