4 ms·

Dall-E 2 seems to be incapable to catch the essence of the art. I'm not really surprised by it, I'd be surprised a lot if it could. But nevertheless: if you loo

by ordu 5y ago

Dall-E 2 seems to be incapable to catch the essence of the art. I'm not really surprised by it, I'd be surprised a lot if it could. But nevertheless: if you looked in the eye of a Girl With A Pearl Earring[1], you'd be forced to stop and to think what does she have on her mind right now. Or may be you had some other question in your mind, but it really stops people to think. But none of Dall-E interpretations have this quality. Works inspired by Girl With A Pearl Earring sometimes have at least part of that power, like Girl With a Babmoo Earring[2]. But none of Dall-E interpretations have such a power. And this observation may lead to a great consequences for visual arts. I had a lot of joy of looking at different Dall-E interpretations to find what the flaw of the interpretation that forbids it to be a piece of art of an equal value to the original. It is a ready made tool to search for explanations of the Power of Art. It cannot say what detail make a picture to be an artwork, but it allow to see multiple data points, and to narrow the hypothesis space. My main conclusion is that the pearl earring have nothing to do with the power of art. It is something in the eye, and probably with the slightly opened mouth. (Somehow Dall-E pictured all interpretations with closed lips, so it seems to be an important thing, but I need more variation along this axis to be sure). [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Girl_with_a_Pearl_Earring https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Girl_with_a_Pearl_Earring [2] https://yourartshop-noldenh.com/awol-erizku-girl-with-the-pearl-earring https://yourartshop-noldenh.com/awol-erizku-girl-with-the-pe...

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
joshcryer 5y ago
What do you think of the third to last image of the Girl With A Pearl Earring that DALL-E 2 created? I find it more compelling than the original with how her face is deeply cast in shadow. There's still that original 'essence' of the glint in her eye. But her earring is a bell. As if the AI is sending a message that what if the bell were to ring?
- ordu 5y ago
  I'm not sure, that I can express myself in English, which is not my native language, and this needs some very nuanced control over tiniest shades of meaning, but I'll try nevertheless, just for fun of it at least. The original girl is more open, more independent and mindless. The interpretation's girl is more self-controlled, assertive and not interested really, just going throw all those movements of regular communication between people. Maybe it's just me, but what I really value on such occasions is mindlessness, the ability of people to not mind themselves, to let their selves to dissolve in the environment. I cannot keep tears in my eyes sometimes when I watch some entertainer playing Chopin or Paganini, because what I see in their movements is complete dissolution of a person in a piece of music, in a piece of art and skill. An entertainer just do what they do with their full attention on it, and with all their motivation focused on it. There is nothing here for them, just them and their actions. There is not a single thought devoted to how people around me would react to what I do and how I do that. I just do what I do and I do not care about people around me, and if it somehow makes people happy... I don't care really. I mean I know that afterwards I'd feel a pride of myself, but just for now I don't really care. I know this feeling. I like to sing, and I'm good at it (above average), and I know what it feels like to dissolve into the song and to let song to rule. I play piano and I know what it is like to dissolve into the piece I'm playing, to stop myself from existing, to let music to take the lead. And the original painting make me believe that the girl is in this state of mind. I do not know the history or the remaining of the story, I do not know if she get into this state for a second, of she never leaves it (it may be a sad experience, don't you think?), but somehow I know that right now she is right in this state. I want to watch this her moment for an eternity. Thinking about it, I'd confess that Interpretation Girl does trigger the same, but on a smaller scale. I feel how my mind is trying to find a coherent state to her gaze, but this feeling stops in tens of microseconds, not hundreds of them. edit: want->watch. Stupid mistake ruining the meaning of the sentence.
Veedrac 5y ago
Initial Outputs from New AI Model Not As Good at Nuance as Historic Artwork, Approach Deemed Hopeless
- ordu 5y ago
  Oh... Not hopeless. The very fact that I spent some minutes watching Interpretations of Girl With a Pearl Earring, is the enough evidence that it is not hopeless. I praise the work that was done. Moreover I hoped that people would get it as an inspiration to do even more.
jdrc 5y ago
art criticism should be off topic here. This is more like chopping off the visual cortex and some association cortex from a brain and stimulating it. there is no person signaling to us, nor can we attribute any striking images that may come up to a person with agency. But its like a giant database of decent clipart for anything we can imagine
- ordu 5y ago
  > This is more like chopping off the visual cortex and some association cortex from a brain and stimulating it. We do not know exactly what part of our perception of reality can be attributed to "the visual cortex and some association cortex". But now we can feel it. We can test it. We can compare ourselves with the cold calculating machine. I believe that it is a priceless opportunity that we shouldn't miss. At least I personally can't. I'm going to figure out is it possible to me to have such a companion as Dall-E in mine wanderings in a sea of information in Internet, and if it is, then to get one. > But its like a giant database of decent clipart for anything we can imagine And this also. Yes. Though I'm not interested in clipart.
hcks 5y ago
On the meta level, we are now at the point where the dubious comments downplaying the AI starts arguing on the plane of art criticism
- whateveracct 5y ago
  Well that's mostly because the entire conversation in this thread has been calling the generated images Art

by ordu 5y ago

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

joshcryer 5y ago

What do you think of the third to last image of the Girl With A Pearl Earring that DALL-E 2 created? I find it more compelling than the original with how her face is deeply cast in shadow. There's still that original 'essence' of the glint in her eye. But her earring is a bell. As if the AI is sending a message that what if the bell were to ring?

ordu 5y ago
I'm not sure, that I can express myself in English, which is not my native language, and this needs some very nuanced control over tiniest shades of meaning, but I'll try nevertheless, just for fun of it at least. The original girl is more open, more independent and mindless. The interpretation's girl is more self-controlled, assertive and not interested really, just going throw all those movements of regular communication between people. Maybe it's just me, but what I really value on such occasions is mindlessness, the ability of people to not mind themselves, to let their selves to dissolve in the environment. I cannot keep tears in my eyes sometimes when I watch some entertainer playing Chopin or Paganini, because what I see in their movements is complete dissolution of a person in a piece of music, in a piece of art and skill. An entertainer just do what they do with their full attention on it, and with all their motivation focused on it. There is nothing here for them, just them and their actions. There is not a single thought devoted to how people around me would react to what I do and how I do that. I just do what I do and I do not care about people around me, and if it somehow makes people happy... I don't care really. I mean I know that afterwards I'd feel a pride of myself, but just for now I don't really care. I know this feeling. I like to sing, and I'm good at it (above average), and I know what it feels like to dissolve into the song and to let song to rule. I play piano and I know what it is like to dissolve into the piece I'm playing, to stop myself from existing, to let music to take the lead. And the original painting make me believe that the girl is in this state of mind. I do not know the history or the remaining of the story, I do not know if she get into this state for a second, of she never leaves it (it may be a sad experience, don't you think?), but somehow I know that right now she is right in this state. I want to watch this her moment for an eternity. Thinking about it, I'd confess that Interpretation Girl does trigger the same, but on a smaller scale. I feel how my mind is trying to find a coherent state to her gaze, but this feeling stops in tens of microseconds, not hundreds of them. edit: want->watch. Stupid mistake ruining the meaning of the sentence.

Veedrac 5y ago

Initial Outputs from New AI Model Not As Good at Nuance as Historic Artwork, Approach Deemed Hopeless

ordu 5y ago
Oh... Not hopeless. The very fact that I spent some minutes watching Interpretations of Girl With a Pearl Earring, is the enough evidence that it is not hopeless. I praise the work that was done. Moreover I hoped that people would get it as an inspiration to do even more.

jdrc 5y ago

art criticism should be off topic here. This is more like chopping off the visual cortex and some association cortex from a brain and stimulating it. there is no person signaling to us, nor can we attribute any striking images that may come up to a person with agency. But its like a giant database of decent clipart for anything we can imagine

ordu 5y ago
> This is more like chopping off the visual cortex and some association cortex from a brain and stimulating it. We do not know exactly what part of our perception of reality can be attributed to "the visual cortex and some association cortex". But now we can feel it. We can test it. We can compare ourselves with the cold calculating machine. I believe that it is a priceless opportunity that we shouldn't miss. At least I personally can't. I'm going to figure out is it possible to me to have such a companion as Dall-E in mine wanderings in a sea of information in Internet, and if it is, then to get one. > But its like a giant database of decent clipart for anything we can imagine And this also. Yes. Though I'm not interested in clipart.

hcks 5y ago

On the meta level, we are now at the point where the dubious comments downplaying the AI starts arguing on the plane of art criticism

whateveracct 5y ago
Well that's mostly because the entire conversation in this thread has been calling the generated images Art