3 ms·

That’s less than 1/4 of the stolen funds. Is everyone getting a 1/4 haircut on their money? Or are they going to try to continue operating as if nothing has hap

That’s less than 1/4 of the stolen funds. Is everyone getting a 1/4 haircut on their money? Or are they going to try to continue operating as if nothing has happened and hope that no more than 1/4 of users withdraw their money? I wonder how much they had to give up to take that much investment money that wouldn’t even get them back to being whole.

mcintyre1994 5y ago
> The new round, combined with Sky Mavis and Axie balance sheet funds, will ensure that all users are reimbursed. It sounds like they're putting in a bunch of their own money as well to reimburse people. I guess we'll only find out when they actually do that though if they are doing a full reimbursement.
boeingUH60 5y ago
From the post; "The round combined with Sky Mavis balance sheet funds, will be used to ensure that all users affected by the Ronin Validator Hack will be reimbursed. "
- lupire 5y ago
  "reimbursed" does not mean 100%.
  - willcipriano 5y ago
    reimburse rē″ĭm-bûrs′ transitive verb To repay (money spent); refund. To pay back or compensate (another party) for money spent or losses incurred. To replace in a treasury or purse, as an equivalent for what has been taken, lost, or expended; to refund; to pay back; to restore. Its unclear if it does according to this definition. I could see it either way.
    - gilleain 5y ago
      Yes, a 'reimbursement' is a direction of a payment (in my understanding). A payment can be in full, or partial so yes you can have a partial reimbursement.
  - duxup 5y ago
    > Sky Mavis is committed to reimbursing all of our users' lost funds Maybe they turn around and don’t do it but that sounds like all.
    - h2odragon 5y ago
      all users get some refund, or all users get all funds refunded? ambiguity like that doesn't come cheap or easy
      - duxup 5y ago
        I don’t that sentence is that confusing.
        somebodythere 5y ago
        It's definitely written in a way that all users could be partially refunded, and still be truthful. It's quite likely that Sky Mavis doesn't manage to come up with the money to make all their users whole, and as such it would be risky to promise to fully reimburse all users.
      - FatalLogic 5y ago
        >all users get some refund, or all users get all funds refunded? ambiguity like that doesn't come cheap or easy No, it's unambiguous. "All of our users' lost funds" doesn't imply "But not all of the funds". Nor can it mean "But not all of the users". The meaning of their statement is clear, unless they're going ridiculous and disputing definitions, such as: What are "funds", or Who is a "user" But whether it's possible for them to honor that promise? Seems doubtful. I find it very hard to believe that they can promptly conjure up over half a billion dollars to refund their users. Firstly because I'd ask: what were they doing with that excess capital before? edit: Although "committed to" does not mean "anytime soon"! Perhaps they plan to issue a token of some kind, and pray they can keep going and gradually make the users whole?
lupire 5y ago
As long as insiders control 75% of the coins over time, through their fees or through the control, they can reimburse users fully (minus fees paid to Sky Mavis). Remember, if you scam or charge $700M from your casino game users, you can accept $625M lost to theft and still make a profit. But the announcement says "if this isn't enough to stabilize the coin, we'll take a treasury vote" presumably either to raise more funds or to default on their (non-legal) obligations to users. Code is law. Radical decentralization. Users should not expect to get any money back from Sky Mavis (or any other cryptocurrency system). That's what they signed up for.

mcintyre1994 5y ago

> The new round, combined with Sky Mavis and Axie balance sheet funds, will ensure that all users are reimbursed. It sounds like they're putting in a bunch of their own money as well to reimburse people. I guess we'll only find out when they actually do that though if they are doing a full reimbursement.

boeingUH60 5y ago

From the post; "The round combined with Sky Mavis balance sheet funds, will be used to ensure that all users affected by the Ronin Validator Hack will be reimbursed. "

lupire 5y ago
"reimbursed" does not mean 100%.
- willcipriano 5y ago
  reimburse rē″ĭm-bûrs′ transitive verb To repay (money spent); refund. To pay back or compensate (another party) for money spent or losses incurred. To replace in a treasury or purse, as an equivalent for what has been taken, lost, or expended; to refund; to pay back; to restore. Its unclear if it does according to this definition. I could see it either way.
  - gilleain 5y ago
    Yes, a 'reimbursement' is a direction of a payment (in my understanding). A payment can be in full, or partial so yes you can have a partial reimbursement.
- duxup 5y ago
  > Sky Mavis is committed to reimbursing all of our users' lost funds Maybe they turn around and don’t do it but that sounds like all.
  - h2odragon 5y ago
    all users get some refund, or all users get all funds refunded? ambiguity like that doesn't come cheap or easy
    - duxup 5y ago
      I don’t that sentence is that confusing.
      - somebodythere 5y ago
        It's definitely written in a way that all users could be partially refunded, and still be truthful. It's quite likely that Sky Mavis doesn't manage to come up with the money to make all their users whole, and as such it would be risky to promise to fully reimburse all users.
    - FatalLogic 5y ago
      >all users get some refund, or all users get all funds refunded? ambiguity like that doesn't come cheap or easy No, it's unambiguous. "All of our users' lost funds" doesn't imply "But not all of the funds". Nor can it mean "But not all of the users". The meaning of their statement is clear, unless they're going ridiculous and disputing definitions, such as: What are "funds", or Who is a "user" But whether it's possible for them to honor that promise? Seems doubtful. I find it very hard to believe that they can promptly conjure up over half a billion dollars to refund their users. Firstly because I'd ask: what were they doing with that excess capital before? edit: Although "committed to" does not mean "anytime soon"! Perhaps they plan to issue a token of some kind, and pray they can keep going and gradually make the users whole?

lupire 5y ago

As long as insiders control 75% of the coins over time, through their fees or through the control, they can reimburse users fully (minus fees paid to Sky Mavis). Remember, if you scam or charge $700M from your casino game users, you can accept $625M lost to theft and still make a profit. But the announcement says "if this isn't enough to stabilize the coin, we'll take a treasury vote" presumably either to raise more funds or to default on their (non-legal) obligations to users. Code is law. Radical decentralization. Users should not expect to get any money back from Sky Mavis (or any other cryptocurrency system). That's what they signed up for.