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You won't find any sympathy for that position here because nobody complaining about social media is actually arguing against censorship, they're arguing against

You won't find any sympathy for that position here because nobody complaining about social media is actually arguing against censorship, they're arguing against moderation. HN is also not an unmoderated forum. You don't get to post whatever you want here. I also don't get to post whatever I want here, and I'm willing to make that compromise so nobody ruins the place with toxicity and spam and conspiracy theories. You can very easily witness the consequences of not doing that, by taking a look at 8chan or Parler.

A4ET8a8uTh0 5y ago
I am not fishing for sympathy. I am arguing for a set of values that are a supposed foundations of US. Now, I personally find it troubling that so many people seem to want to upend that foundation.
- jermaustin1 5y ago
  > foundations of US. I'm not sure if you are meaning United States or emphasizing humanity, but in either direction: a private company's social media application gets to chose the content that goes on the platform. I'm all for free speech as intended by the constitution. I can say hateful things, and cannot be prosecuted by it. BUT I'm perfectly fine in a world where if I say something against a "Do no harm" policy of a website, I get kicked off that platform.
- sanderjd 5y ago
  The private freedom of association is just as foundational to the US (and liberal society broadly) as the freedom to speak without government intervention.
  - A4ET8a8uTh0 5y ago
    Is it a private association when the extent of a reach of a given entity rivals that of a nation-state? I am not disagreeing with your argument in principle. There has to be balance. Right now, that balance is out of whack.
    - sanderjd 5y ago
      Yes. The public can choose to create a legal structure that does not let private entities grow so large, but we have not chosen to do so, and that choice does not mean that private entities are de facto public.
      - A4ET8a8uTh0 5y ago
        Those structures already exist. They are typically categorized under anti-trust category. The issue is that between regulatory capture, revolving door, dual party system and average voter distracted by carefully selected social issues, the choice is theoretical. I am not automatically arguing they should be public. I am saying they should be cut down to size.
        throwaway82652 5y ago
        >I am saying they should be cut down to size. I've heard that a countless number of times and yet nobody has been able to come up with a good way to do that or even demonstrate that it needs to be done, or demonstrate what it would accomplish, or demonstrate that it would not make the problem worse. Every congressional hearing I've seen has ended with a failure to even explain the basic reasons why it's being done. It all seems to eventually revert back on a list of personal grievances that some individual or group might have with the company, which do not require antitrust action to correct, and the judges notice this and throw the case out. I would be much more in favor of something like GDPR, but the US has no political will to enact something like that, it's all personal grievances all the way down, on both sides of the aisle.

A4ET8a8uTh0 5y ago

I am not fishing for sympathy. I am arguing for a set of values that are a supposed foundations of US. Now, I personally find it troubling that so many people seem to want to upend that foundation.

jermaustin1 5y ago
> foundations of US. I'm not sure if you are meaning United States or emphasizing humanity, but in either direction: a private company's social media application gets to chose the content that goes on the platform. I'm all for free speech as intended by the constitution. I can say hateful things, and cannot be prosecuted by it. BUT I'm perfectly fine in a world where if I say something against a "Do no harm" policy of a website, I get kicked off that platform.
sanderjd 5y ago
The private freedom of association is just as foundational to the US (and liberal society broadly) as the freedom to speak without government intervention.
- A4ET8a8uTh0 5y ago
  Is it a private association when the extent of a reach of a given entity rivals that of a nation-state? I am not disagreeing with your argument in principle. There has to be balance. Right now, that balance is out of whack.
  - sanderjd 5y ago
    Yes. The public can choose to create a legal structure that does not let private entities grow so large, but we have not chosen to do so, and that choice does not mean that private entities are de facto public.
    - A4ET8a8uTh0 5y ago
      Those structures already exist. They are typically categorized under anti-trust category. The issue is that between regulatory capture, revolving door, dual party system and average voter distracted by carefully selected social issues, the choice is theoretical. I am not automatically arguing they should be public. I am saying they should be cut down to size.
      - throwaway82652 5y ago
        >I am saying they should be cut down to size. I've heard that a countless number of times and yet nobody has been able to come up with a good way to do that or even demonstrate that it needs to be done, or demonstrate what it would accomplish, or demonstrate that it would not make the problem worse. Every congressional hearing I've seen has ended with a failure to even explain the basic reasons why it's being done. It all seems to eventually revert back on a list of personal grievances that some individual or group might have with the company, which do not require antitrust action to correct, and the judges notice this and throw the case out. I would be much more in favor of something like GDPR, but the US has no political will to enact something like that, it's all personal grievances all the way down, on both sides of the aisle.