4 ms·

I wonder how much e-waste this USB-C bullshit idea generated. It's not even a one-off, "early adopter" problem, considering that even now it's hard to buy somet

I wonder how much e-waste this USB-C bullshit idea generated. It's not even a one-off, "early adopter" problem, considering that even now it's hard to buy something that actually works and you have to churn through many attempts before getting lucky. In contrast, I can't remember the last time I bought a USB-A, HDMI or Ethernet cable/peripheral that didn't work, partly because those specs are self-contained and simple enough that even the cheapest manufacturer will typically do a good enough job.

HNHatesUsers 5y ago
moduspol 5y ago
I still get the same issue with HDMI cables when you want to do more than 4K (like 4K60 4:4:4) with a cable that's more than half a meter long. Cable length apparently significantly impacts throughput. It's even worse on Amazon when a seller will list multiple lengths of the same cable, as there'll be reviews about how this works great for (e.g.) Dolby Vision on an Apple TV 4K, but that was for the short cable. That doesn't imply the longer version of the same cable will work for the same application.
npunt 5y ago
Big picture, USB-C is set to considerably reduce ewaste given that more and more consumer electronics products are standardizing on it as a charging solution, eliminating custom chargers and letting manufacturers get away with not including a charger. This is likely to be accelerated by regulations in the EU. The last time we had this level of standardization was probably the AA battery. Not saying things are perfect (because they obviously aren't) but computers - and especially finicky docks and high performance cables - are just one part of a much much bigger market for USB-C.
- ClumsyPilot 5y ago
  "Big picture, USB-C is set to considerably reduce ewaste" In 20 years once they atoned fir the dongle sins, I have 6 usbC adapters around the house
- toastal 5y ago
  Meanwhile, so many USB-C hubs don't actually have any USB-C ports despite the writing on the wall and it only being a matter of time.
oneplane 5y ago
Ironically, my older USB-A (2.0 and 1.1), HDMI and Ethernet cables and hubs all work fine, but every time I buy a new version (consumer/retail) there is always something wrong with them. Bought a USB-A hub because I needed a few extra ports for low speed devices; didn't work... turns out all the D+ and D- lines had a very high resistance to the point there the USB protocol just wouldn't work. HDMI cable, didn't work for anything beyond 720p. Ethernet cable, didn't work beyond 100Mbit, turned out to be a crappy CCS/CCA cable, said copper on the packaging, had copper in the connectors. Cutting the cable showed it was just a clad cable and the ends were dipped so you can't see it in the connector. And returning them, the replacements almost always had the same issue because it was a bad design in the first place and you just had to get lucky that you got the "least broken" one in the batch. It wasn't a price point thing either, all of them are just crap until you get to the "we cannot afford to shit on our brand name" products.
icelancer 5y ago
Yeah, a perfect example are all the people in this thread recommending Thunderbolt devices while a bunch of us sit here and type away on our Ryzen or Threadripper powered machines. USB-C has been such a massive disappointment.
- mey 5y ago
  ASUS has Thunderbolt 4 motherboards for Ryzen. https://www.asus.com/ProArt/Motherboards-Home/ https://www.asus.com/ProArt/Motherboards-Home/
  - icelancer 5y ago
    Unfortunately I've never really needed USB-C for my desktops/servers - primarily my laptops.
- microtonal 5y ago
  I have a laptop that is powerful as a Ryzen 5x00, which is quiet and uses very little power. I can take it with me in my backpack and hook it up to my three workspaces by plugging one Thunderbolt over USB-C cable. (I use a Startech Thunderbolt Dock, which hasn't had any issues, except the dislikable Realtek NIC.) I don't want to go back to the workstation tower life. Unfortunately, I still have to keep around a Ryzen machine for CUDA. But it is loud (even with Noctua fans), eats large amounts of power, and is completely non-portable.
  - stonecharioteer 5y ago
    What do you mean Thunderbolt over USB-C. You can find converters? Link me please Senpai.
- mschuster91 5y ago
  The real disappointment is Intel who have kept an iron grip on Thunderbolt for way over a decade and prevented everyone from distributing Thunderbolt without an Intel CPU for no technical reason at all.
542458 5y ago
USB-A: there are so many crap usb-A cables around that either a) don’t charge b) don’t reliably send data or c) work, but with massive voltage drops leading to very slow charging. HDMI: HDMI will silently degrade to lower versions of the spec over bad connections, so it might just be that the bad cables are invisible.
manicdee 5y ago
One piece of e waste I had was an entire MacBook Air which was bricked by a USB-C hub with power delivery which Dane highly recommended. Apple fixed that problem by updating their firmware. Apparently even Apple has trouble with USB-C.
torginus 5y ago
Once you go over 1080p, I found that most (>50%) HDMI cables that advertise HDMI 2.0 (or even 2.1) either do not work at all, or have constant cutouts at 4K@60. Also I found that there is no correlation between how nice cables look, how expensive they are and how well they work. The only HDMI cables that I had 100% success with, were the ones that came bundled with A/V equipment, even if some of them look like bottom shelf stuff.

HNHatesUsers 5y ago

moduspol 5y ago

I still get the same issue with HDMI cables when you want to do more than 4K (like 4K60 4:4:4) with a cable that's more than half a meter long. Cable length apparently significantly impacts throughput. It's even worse on Amazon when a seller will list multiple lengths of the same cable, as there'll be reviews about how this works great for (e.g.) Dolby Vision on an Apple TV 4K, but that was for the short cable. That doesn't imply the longer version of the same cable will work for the same application.

npunt 5y ago

Big picture, USB-C is set to considerably reduce ewaste given that more and more consumer electronics products are standardizing on it as a charging solution, eliminating custom chargers and letting manufacturers get away with not including a charger. This is likely to be accelerated by regulations in the EU. The last time we had this level of standardization was probably the AA battery. Not saying things are perfect (because they obviously aren't) but computers - and especially finicky docks and high performance cables - are just one part of a much much bigger market for USB-C.

ClumsyPilot 5y ago
"Big picture, USB-C is set to considerably reduce ewaste" In 20 years once they atoned fir the dongle sins, I have 6 usbC adapters around the house
toastal 5y ago
Meanwhile, so many USB-C hubs don't actually have any USB-C ports despite the writing on the wall and it only being a matter of time.

oneplane 5y ago

Ironically, my older USB-A (2.0 and 1.1), HDMI and Ethernet cables and hubs all work fine, but every time I buy a new version (consumer/retail) there is always something wrong with them. Bought a USB-A hub because I needed a few extra ports for low speed devices; didn't work... turns out all the D+ and D- lines had a very high resistance to the point there the USB protocol just wouldn't work. HDMI cable, didn't work for anything beyond 720p. Ethernet cable, didn't work beyond 100Mbit, turned out to be a crappy CCS/CCA cable, said copper on the packaging, had copper in the connectors. Cutting the cable showed it was just a clad cable and the ends were dipped so you can't see it in the connector. And returning them, the replacements almost always had the same issue because it was a bad design in the first place and you just had to get lucky that you got the "least broken" one in the batch. It wasn't a price point thing either, all of them are just crap until you get to the "we cannot afford to shit on our brand name" products.

icelancer 5y ago

Yeah, a perfect example are all the people in this thread recommending Thunderbolt devices while a bunch of us sit here and type away on our Ryzen or Threadripper powered machines. USB-C has been such a massive disappointment.

mey 5y ago
ASUS has Thunderbolt 4 motherboards for Ryzen. https://www.asus.com/ProArt/Motherboards-Home/ https://www.asus.com/ProArt/Motherboards-Home/
- icelancer 5y ago
  Unfortunately I've never really needed USB-C for my desktops/servers - primarily my laptops.
microtonal 5y ago
I have a laptop that is powerful as a Ryzen 5x00, which is quiet and uses very little power. I can take it with me in my backpack and hook it up to my three workspaces by plugging one Thunderbolt over USB-C cable. (I use a Startech Thunderbolt Dock, which hasn't had any issues, except the dislikable Realtek NIC.) I don't want to go back to the workstation tower life. Unfortunately, I still have to keep around a Ryzen machine for CUDA. But it is loud (even with Noctua fans), eats large amounts of power, and is completely non-portable.
- stonecharioteer 5y ago
  What do you mean Thunderbolt over USB-C. You can find converters? Link me please Senpai.
mschuster91 5y ago
The real disappointment is Intel who have kept an iron grip on Thunderbolt for way over a decade and prevented everyone from distributing Thunderbolt without an Intel CPU for no technical reason at all.

542458 5y ago

USB-A: there are so many crap usb-A cables around that either a) don’t charge b) don’t reliably send data or c) work, but with massive voltage drops leading to very slow charging. HDMI: HDMI will silently degrade to lower versions of the spec over bad connections, so it might just be that the bad cables are invisible.

manicdee 5y ago

One piece of e waste I had was an entire MacBook Air which was bricked by a USB-C hub with power delivery which Dane highly recommended. Apple fixed that problem by updating their firmware. Apparently even Apple has trouble with USB-C.

torginus 5y ago

Once you go over 1080p, I found that most (>50%) HDMI cables that advertise HDMI 2.0 (or even 2.1) either do not work at all, or have constant cutouts at 4K@60. Also I found that there is no correlation between how nice cables look, how expensive they are and how well they work. The only HDMI cables that I had 100% success with, were the ones that came bundled with A/V equipment, even if some of them look like bottom shelf stuff.