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Nobody in the world wants a nuclear-armed Kazakhstan. On the other hand, Kazakhstan is much more stable politically, not permanently bankrupt or begging, and a

Nobody in the world wants a nuclear-armed Kazakhstan. On the other hand, Kazakhstan is much more stable politically, not permanently bankrupt or begging, and actually has good relations with both Russia and the West - all of that compared to Ukraine. Not sure they really want a nuclear survivor adventure instead.

actionfromafar 5y ago
Kazakhstan is stable politically in much the same way as North Korea is stable politically. (Just in case someone thought of democracy when they read "stable".)
- thriftwy 5y ago
  Democracy is shrinking around the world, so as much as we like the concept theoretically, we should probably remove it from the definition of "stable". China seems quite stable too. And Kazakhstan is not quite locked down like North Korea. You were thinking Turkmenistan, or just projecting your prejudice towards all Central Asia. It is not without problems, of course.
BayAreaEscapee 5y ago
Ukraine had stable relations with Russia until they decided they wanted to align with the west and adopt democracy when there was a color revolution in 2014. If they had remained a vassal state of Russia, their relationship would still be stable. Similarly, the situation in Kazakhstan is stable because they are a vassal state of Russia. Watch what happened when there was the beginning of a color revolution there earlier this year: Russian quickly sent troops to assist the Kazakh government in violently putting it down. If a successful color revolution was to happen in Kazakhstan (unlikely), Russia would be playing the same military games with them that they are now doing with Ukraine.
- thriftwy 5y ago
  But Kazakhstan is already very well aligned with the West. In many areas its policies are more westernized than these of Ukraine. It also has the economy to apply these policies to. It's just realistic about needing to be reasonably polite with Russia, its largest neighbour and biggest trade partner, while minding its own business. Is there an example of a "successful" color revolution which brougt democracy and prosperity, instead of bringing Russian tanks and more coups de etat? You are exactly right - if one of these happens in Kazakhstan, RIP Kazakhstan. It's too complex of a country already.
- antocv 5y ago
  Ukraine was not a vassal state from 1991 to 2014. Read the Independence Act of Ukraine from 1991, a referendum was held on that act by the entire population and approved with a clear majority. The text clearly states that Ukraine should be independent and neutral status, it shall not join any military block. By 2013-2014 calls for joining EU which has a defensive clause, effectively are calls to cancel the Independence Act of Ukraine.

actionfromafar 5y ago

Kazakhstan is stable politically in much the same way as North Korea is stable politically. (Just in case someone thought of democracy when they read "stable".)

thriftwy 5y ago
Democracy is shrinking around the world, so as much as we like the concept theoretically, we should probably remove it from the definition of "stable". China seems quite stable too. And Kazakhstan is not quite locked down like North Korea. You were thinking Turkmenistan, or just projecting your prejudice towards all Central Asia. It is not without problems, of course.

BayAreaEscapee 5y ago

Ukraine had stable relations with Russia until they decided they wanted to align with the west and adopt democracy when there was a color revolution in 2014. If they had remained a vassal state of Russia, their relationship would still be stable. Similarly, the situation in Kazakhstan is stable because they are a vassal state of Russia. Watch what happened when there was the beginning of a color revolution there earlier this year: Russian quickly sent troops to assist the Kazakh government in violently putting it down. If a successful color revolution was to happen in Kazakhstan (unlikely), Russia would be playing the same military games with them that they are now doing with Ukraine.

thriftwy 5y ago
But Kazakhstan is already very well aligned with the West. In many areas its policies are more westernized than these of Ukraine. It also has the economy to apply these policies to. It's just realistic about needing to be reasonably polite with Russia, its largest neighbour and biggest trade partner, while minding its own business. Is there an example of a "successful" color revolution which brougt democracy and prosperity, instead of bringing Russian tanks and more coups de etat? You are exactly right - if one of these happens in Kazakhstan, RIP Kazakhstan. It's too complex of a country already.
antocv 5y ago
Ukraine was not a vassal state from 1991 to 2014. Read the Independence Act of Ukraine from 1991, a referendum was held on that act by the entire population and approved with a clear majority. The text clearly states that Ukraine should be independent and neutral status, it shall not join any military block. By 2013-2014 calls for joining EU which has a defensive clause, effectively are calls to cancel the Independence Act of Ukraine.