5 ms·

Then what is the point of these threads? > Product I use is bad > Use other product > No >:( These threads are pretty pointless as it is, but if we avoid me

Then what is the point of these threads? > Product I use is bad > Use other product > No >:( These threads are pretty pointless as it is, but if we avoid mentioning the only solution that exists and how to do that, switching to Linux, then the thread is literally just a bunch of complaining

lostgame 5y ago
Switching to Linux is obviously not the only solution - and somehow trying to argue that it’s the case is not only ignorant - but straight-up what my core issue is with Linux evangelism. There is such a lack of consideration for the average end-user - who would never deal with the layers that come with a Linux distro in the evangelical Linux community - it seriously drives me crazy sometimes. Like - the only solution? … There is an entire other OS and ecosystem called MacOS, that doesn’t have these issues like built-in advertising - allows for natively running the proprietary software most people need without some weird translation layer in between - and if you don’t like that - there are ways to tweak Windows into being semi-sorta-not-really-but-whatever level acceptable. It even runs most Linux software, to boot. Almost like it’s the best of all worlds, or something. And if you want to bitch about the proprietary hardware ‘needed’ for MacOS - to be frank - in about 15 years or so of playing with both Hackintoshes and various Linux distributions…I honestly found them to be about equal in terms of hardware support and annoyance of configuration. In the last 4-5 years I’ve actually had better luck with plug and play hardware support on Hackintoshes. (It’s amazing how fantastic that community is! Most of my computers are totally plug and play. My 80-year-old grandma did it last year, first try - after trying and failing several times with Ubuntu, on her bog-standard Dell tower…) So, point in case - is the average person supposed to go fishing around for drivers or go out to purchase specific hardware so it works with their Linux distribution? Do they want to dig through package managers to find whatever alternatives exist to the software they need and already know how to use? Obviously not, and; no. :P So is Linux even a ‘solution’ at all for at least 80% of people who don’t even get what a ‘driver’ is? Of course not! So it certainly can’t be the ‘only’ solution. Even convincing the average Windows user to go over to MacOS - even if you hand them a Mac - is pretty tough, honestly. (Speaking from experience…) I’d never, nor have I ever - recommend(ed) any Linux distribution to anyone who wasn’t a serious techie. Heck, I don’t recommend it in general, unless you’re lucky enough to be a programmer who doesn’t have to work on proprietary systems, and are dual-booting alongside an OS that can natively run the proprietary software 90% of people rely on and already know how to use. If you’re curious and tech-savvy - of course - go for it! I’ve recommended dual-booting to a few techie friends, and I have nothing against Linux - honesty except for the people who are blindly evangelical about it and forget about the real people in the world who aren’t techies. For the average person - Linux is a perfect case of ‘free isn’t free’. An aside: You know what is likeliest to replace Windows, which sucks balls? Android. Because honestly, other than the built-in ads, on a default installation, with telemetry enabled, it would be tough to tell which OS is worse for your privacy. I’d be curious to see a highly technical comparison on that!
- blindmute 5y ago
  You have a strange bias against Linux. I've convinced many non tech people to install Ubuntu and Mint without trouble. My grandma literally uses Fedora that I installed for her. During all these installations, it just worked; there was no driver issue to fix on any machine. In my experience talking to others, going from windows to OSX is infinitely more jarring than going to Linux (Cinnamon). I also think you're overestimating how many people need proprietary Windows software, by a lot. If you're stuck on Windows, that sucks, but switching OS is the only solution to a hostile OS. You can tweak Windows however you want; it is still going to push updates that ignore your wishes and annoy you. We shouldn't stop recommending the best solution because you personally can't switch.

lostgame 5y ago

Switching to Linux is obviously not the only solution - and somehow trying to argue that it’s the case is not only ignorant - but straight-up what my core issue is with Linux evangelism. There is such a lack of consideration for the average end-user - who would never deal with the layers that come with a Linux distro in the evangelical Linux community - it seriously drives me crazy sometimes. Like - the only solution? … There is an entire other OS and ecosystem called MacOS, that doesn’t have these issues like built-in advertising - allows for natively running the proprietary software most people need without some weird translation layer in between - and if you don’t like that - there are ways to tweak Windows into being semi-sorta-not-really-but-whatever level acceptable. It even runs most Linux software, to boot. Almost like it’s the best of all worlds, or something. And if you want to bitch about the proprietary hardware ‘needed’ for MacOS - to be frank - in about 15 years or so of playing with both Hackintoshes and various Linux distributions…I honestly found them to be about equal in terms of hardware support and annoyance of configuration. In the last 4-5 years I’ve actually had better luck with plug and play hardware support on Hackintoshes. (It’s amazing how fantastic that community is! Most of my computers are totally plug and play. My 80-year-old grandma did it last year, first try - after trying and failing several times with Ubuntu, on her bog-standard Dell tower…) So, point in case - is the average person supposed to go fishing around for drivers or go out to purchase specific hardware so it works with their Linux distribution? Do they want to dig through package managers to find whatever alternatives exist to the software they need and already know how to use? Obviously not, and; no. :P So is Linux even a ‘solution’ at all for at least 80% of people who don’t even get what a ‘driver’ is? Of course not! So it certainly can’t be the ‘only’ solution. Even convincing the average Windows user to go over to MacOS - even if you hand them a Mac - is pretty tough, honestly. (Speaking from experience…) I’d never, nor have I ever - recommend(ed) any Linux distribution to anyone who wasn’t a serious techie. Heck, I don’t recommend it in general, unless you’re lucky enough to be a programmer who doesn’t have to work on proprietary systems, and are dual-booting alongside an OS that can natively run the proprietary software 90% of people rely on and already know how to use. If you’re curious and tech-savvy - of course - go for it! I’ve recommended dual-booting to a few techie friends, and I have nothing against Linux - honesty except for the people who are blindly evangelical about it and forget about the real people in the world who aren’t techies. For the average person - Linux is a perfect case of ‘free isn’t free’. An aside: You know what is likeliest to replace Windows, which sucks balls? Android. Because honestly, other than the built-in ads, on a default installation, with telemetry enabled, it would be tough to tell which OS is worse for your privacy. I’d be curious to see a highly technical comparison on that!

blindmute 5y ago
You have a strange bias against Linux. I've convinced many non tech people to install Ubuntu and Mint without trouble. My grandma literally uses Fedora that I installed for her. During all these installations, it just worked; there was no driver issue to fix on any machine. In my experience talking to others, going from windows to OSX is infinitely more jarring than going to Linux (Cinnamon). I also think you're overestimating how many people need proprietary Windows software, by a lot. If you're stuck on Windows, that sucks, but switching OS is the only solution to a hostile OS. You can tweak Windows however you want; it is still going to push updates that ignore your wishes and annoy you. We shouldn't stop recommending the best solution because you personally can't switch.