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You're absolutely right, and I've heard firsthand accounts of this. My sister-in-law is a middle school counselor at a large midwest US public school system an

You're absolutely right, and I've heard firsthand accounts of this. My sister-in-law is a middle school counselor at a large midwest US public school system and her stories about kids dealing with the pandemic are heartbreaking, the mental health support system in some US schools is completely falling apart due to the workload. She's never seen a mental health crisis on this scale in schools in her entire career. She remarks that kids really weren't able to learn much during the pandemic due to remote learning and in many cases are now playing catch-up to get back on track. The school system she works for basically didn't hold anyone back for a year because they had no real way of knowing who progressed as her school district cancelled standardized testing. Anyone who believes that the pandemic wasn't a serious setback for many kids developmentally is woefully out of touch with reality.

WalterBright 5y ago
> they had no real way of knowing who progressed as her school district cancelled standardized testing. The schools want to remove all evidence that would contradict their claims of doing a great job.
- thr0wawayf00 5y ago
  ...or they lacked the resources and infrastructure to accurately assess students as nobody had been prepared to move the entire public education system online for an extended period of time.
  - WalterBright 5y ago
    The drive to eliminate all standardized testing has been going on for many years.
    - alar44 5y ago
      Because it's being directly tied to funding. Do well, more funds. Tests are low, less funds. It's completely ass backwards. Teachers aren't afraid of being graded, the issue is what's being done with that information.
      - WalterBright 5y ago
        How about a gymnastics coach? The ones who get results from their students get paid a lot more than the ones who don't. Isn't that how it should be?
        AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
        The result you want from gymnastic coaching is well aligned with what the test measures because, well, the test and the desired result are the same thing. This is not the case with standardized testing in education, is it? It's a lot like these tech interviews people keep complaining about that test a knowledge bunch of bullshit you have to cram for but have nothing to do with the actual job.
        WalterBright 5y ago
        Are you suggesting that it is not possible to test students on things like reading, riting, and rithmetic? 7 + 3 = ? is a bullshit question?
        AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
        Are you suggesting that the only thing worth learning in school is reading, writing, and arithmetic?
    - thr0wawayf00 5y ago
      That's true, but what does that have to do with automatically passing every student during the pandemic? It's just one cynical take after another with you. It's tragic to see someone so intelligent being so bitter about a thankless job like working in public education.
      - WalterBright 5y ago
        Bitter? Not at all. There are some good teachers deserving of thanks. Some I was fortunate to have as a teacher. But I am cynical of an industry that demands 6 figure salaries along with no accountability. Where teachers are rewarded for length of service and educational attainment, not success in educating the students. Want to improve education for the kids? Give teachers a base salary, plus $X for every student of theirs that meets grade standards at the end of the school year. ---- A long time ago, the company I was working for hired a team of 6 or 7 older contractors to do a special job for IBM. They completed it on time, under budget, and IBM was completely satisfied. They also each received a $10,000 bonus for meeting those conditions (a lot of money in those days). I asked them if the bonus had any relationship with meeting that goal, and they were offended, saying they were professionals and gave it their best regardless. Haha, I didn't buy that. Do you? Remember that earthquake in LA where a freeway interchange collapsed? They offered the contractor $1,000,000 for each day ahead of schedule the reconstruction was finished. I don't recall the exact details, but they finished it months ahead of schedule. Money talks. Want results? Pay for results.
        tfigment 5y ago
        Are talking about software or teaching? My accountability is quite low compared to teachers and i make significantly more. I do believe those IBM contractors because it wouldnt motivate me. I'm already doing quite well so you have to get to 1/3 my yearly salary to actually change my behavior but Im a professional so i already give it my all. I do think teachers should make more and software devs should make less but it is not the world we live apparently.
        WalterBright 5y ago

WalterBright 5y ago

> they had no real way of knowing who progressed as her school district cancelled standardized testing. The schools want to remove all evidence that would contradict their claims of doing a great job.

thr0wawayf00 5y ago
...or they lacked the resources and infrastructure to accurately assess students as nobody had been prepared to move the entire public education system online for an extended period of time.
- WalterBright 5y ago
  The drive to eliminate all standardized testing has been going on for many years.
  - alar44 5y ago
    Because it's being directly tied to funding. Do well, more funds. Tests are low, less funds. It's completely ass backwards. Teachers aren't afraid of being graded, the issue is what's being done with that information.
    - WalterBright 5y ago
      How about a gymnastics coach? The ones who get results from their students get paid a lot more than the ones who don't. Isn't that how it should be?
      - AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
        The result you want from gymnastic coaching is well aligned with what the test measures because, well, the test and the desired result are the same thing. This is not the case with standardized testing in education, is it? It's a lot like these tech interviews people keep complaining about that test a knowledge bunch of bullshit you have to cram for but have nothing to do with the actual job.
        WalterBright 5y ago
        Are you suggesting that it is not possible to test students on things like reading, riting, and rithmetic? 7 + 3 = ? is a bullshit question?
        AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
        Are you suggesting that the only thing worth learning in school is reading, writing, and arithmetic?
  - thr0wawayf00 5y ago
    That's true, but what does that have to do with automatically passing every student during the pandemic? It's just one cynical take after another with you. It's tragic to see someone so intelligent being so bitter about a thankless job like working in public education.
    - WalterBright 5y ago
      Bitter? Not at all. There are some good teachers deserving of thanks. Some I was fortunate to have as a teacher. But I am cynical of an industry that demands 6 figure salaries along with no accountability. Where teachers are rewarded for length of service and educational attainment, not success in educating the students. Want to improve education for the kids? Give teachers a base salary, plus $X for every student of theirs that meets grade standards at the end of the school year. ---- A long time ago, the company I was working for hired a team of 6 or 7 older contractors to do a special job for IBM. They completed it on time, under budget, and IBM was completely satisfied. They also each received a $10,000 bonus for meeting those conditions (a lot of money in those days). I asked them if the bonus had any relationship with meeting that goal, and they were offended, saying they were professionals and gave it their best regardless. Haha, I didn't buy that. Do you? Remember that earthquake in LA where a freeway interchange collapsed? They offered the contractor $1,000,000 for each day ahead of schedule the reconstruction was finished. I don't recall the exact details, but they finished it months ahead of schedule. Money talks. Want results? Pay for results.
      - tfigment 5y ago
        Are talking about software or teaching? My accountability is quite low compared to teachers and i make significantly more. I do believe those IBM contractors because it wouldnt motivate me. I'm already doing quite well so you have to get to 1/3 my yearly salary to actually change my behavior but Im a professional so i already give it my all. I do think teachers should make more and software devs should make less but it is not the world we live apparently.
        WalterBright 5y ago