4 ms·

> The female vet students were absolutely shocked and horrified If you look hard enough, I'm sure you can find at least a few people "shocked and horrified" ab

by goto11 5y ago

> The female vet students were absolutely shocked and horrified If you look hard enough, I'm sure you can find at least a few people "shocked and horrified" about absolutely any issue in the world. If you are building an entire argument on the alleged attitudes on some female veterinarian students in some Australian university, it could easily be taken down by a counterexample. For example in this very thread, you have people arguing that it is "systemic discrimination" that men have to sit down concentrate (just like women understand they need to do) in order to achieve a higher education. So clearly the attitude that men should be privileged is alive and well in certain quarters.

scarmig 5y ago
It's apparent that men and women have different learning styles, as evidenced by their widely different outcomes as they go through school. We as a society have constructed an educational system that privileges women, which is ipso facto systemic discrimination that creates a disparate impact.
- goto11 5y ago
  Historically, more men got a higher education. So it seems those men back in the day somehow did manage to sit down and concentrate.
  - scarmig 5y ago
    1) Pedagogy has evolved from the past, in ways that may have been broadly disadvantageous for boys. 2) Just because certain outcomes happen now doesn't mean it's some absolute, immutable state of the world. We can and should have an educational system that serves both boys and girls.
- gitfan86 5y ago
  As a left handed person that has had to deal with a system designed for right handed people, can I also join the pity party, and call myself a victim of discrimination?
  - scarmig 5y ago
    Do left-handed people attend university at a rate a third less than right-handed people do? And, yes, if a school system required all students to write right-handed and that resulted in lower grades and worse outcomes among left-handed students, that would absolutely make you a victim of systemic discrimination.
    - gitfan86 5y ago
      My writing is slower and lower quality while using right handed desks, which I had to use many times in school. If you look hard enough everyone is the "victim of systematic discrimination"
      - scarmig 5y ago
        But you don't have to look hard to see the results of discrimination against men: something like 60% of awarded bachelor degrees are to women. I'd support requiring schools make left-handed desks available to students, and I'm more than happy to make it a major priority if there are statistics indicating that it seriously hampers left-handed students' outcomes.
        goto11 5y ago
        > But you don't have to look hard to see the results of discrimination against men: something like 60% of awarded bachelor degrees are to women. Why do you think this is due to discrimination? Isn't it more likely women are just more willing and able to put in the hard work necessary? If some men feel it is "unfair" that they have to put in the same amount of concentrated study as women to achieve the same degrees, then it is understandable these men are not as successful academically.
        gitfan86 5y ago
        Same question for the CEO ratios. Are board of directors discriminating against women or is it that men are more likely to make the sacrifices to become a CEO?

by goto11 5y ago

scarmig 5y ago

It's apparent that men and women have different learning styles, as evidenced by their widely different outcomes as they go through school. We as a society have constructed an educational system that privileges women, which is ipso facto systemic discrimination that creates a disparate impact.

goto11 5y ago
Historically, more men got a higher education. So it seems those men back in the day somehow did manage to sit down and concentrate.
- scarmig 5y ago
  1) Pedagogy has evolved from the past, in ways that may have been broadly disadvantageous for boys. 2) Just because certain outcomes happen now doesn't mean it's some absolute, immutable state of the world. We can and should have an educational system that serves both boys and girls.
gitfan86 5y ago
As a left handed person that has had to deal with a system designed for right handed people, can I also join the pity party, and call myself a victim of discrimination?
- scarmig 5y ago
  Do left-handed people attend university at a rate a third less than right-handed people do? And, yes, if a school system required all students to write right-handed and that resulted in lower grades and worse outcomes among left-handed students, that would absolutely make you a victim of systemic discrimination.
  - gitfan86 5y ago
    My writing is slower and lower quality while using right handed desks, which I had to use many times in school. If you look hard enough everyone is the "victim of systematic discrimination"
    - scarmig 5y ago
      But you don't have to look hard to see the results of discrimination against men: something like 60% of awarded bachelor degrees are to women. I'd support requiring schools make left-handed desks available to students, and I'm more than happy to make it a major priority if there are statistics indicating that it seriously hampers left-handed students' outcomes.
      - goto11 5y ago
        > But you don't have to look hard to see the results of discrimination against men: something like 60% of awarded bachelor degrees are to women. Why do you think this is due to discrimination? Isn't it more likely women are just more willing and able to put in the hard work necessary? If some men feel it is "unfair" that they have to put in the same amount of concentrated study as women to achieve the same degrees, then it is understandable these men are not as successful academically.
        gitfan86 5y ago
        Same question for the CEO ratios. Are board of directors discriminating against women or is it that men are more likely to make the sacrifices to become a CEO?