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Their argument: "The great man theory is wrong because [actual reasons]." Your argument: "The great man theory is right, you're dumb if you disagree." Sure, I

Their argument: "The great man theory is wrong because [actual reasons]." Your argument: "The great man theory is right, you're dumb if you disagree." Sure, I'm pretty dumb, but why should I believe you?

wly_cdgr 5y ago
A good reason would be the countless examples available freely on sites like GitHub. Also the fact that it is this way in music, art, sculpture, writing, mathematics, game design, sport, cooking, fashion,....it would be shocking indeed if it was any different in programming
- ivraatiems 5y ago
  ...it's your argument. Not on me to prove it for you!
  - wly_cdgr 5y ago
    Sure. But I got better things to do than prove the obvious to people who don't want to believe it
    - exBarrelSpoiler 5y ago
      Then you cede the argument entirely.
- Underphil 5y ago
  If you release on GitHub you have no skin in the game. If you break something or abandon the project entirely (which happens with a breathtaking frequency) you can just move on to something else. Not the same at all.
- drewcoo 5y ago
  Aha. I disagreed with you until you made this point. Now I think I see where you're right and people are talking past each other. Art masterpieces are not built by committee. You list mostly what I'd consider arts. You claim that programming is (like) an art. And I think that's the difference. The opinion you're arguing against comes from the perspective that programming on a larger team to solve real world problems is (like) an engineering discipline. Engineering is both an art and a science, but more importantly engineering is a collaborative process. And that's why the focus of the piece was on social aspects of engineering and avoiding blame culture. We need better terms than were using. "Programming" is about as useful in this discussion as "building things with rock." Does that mean stacking cairns? Does that mean fine art sculpture? Does that mean designing highways and dams?
PeterisP 5y ago
Their entire argument against the great man theory, quoting the original article, is "But it’s also wrong, and toxic to sustainable development and equitable environments." No reasons or arguments are provided, just an assertion. On the other hand, "a lot of the very best software is made by either one person or a very small band of very close collaborators." is an argument - not very strong, but at least something, with prominent examples such as git, tex, Calibre, emacs, OBS, Minecraft, Stardew Valley, Sublime Text and many others.

wly_cdgr 5y ago

A good reason would be the countless examples available freely on sites like GitHub. Also the fact that it is this way in music, art, sculpture, writing, mathematics, game design, sport, cooking, fashion,....it would be shocking indeed if it was any different in programming

ivraatiems 5y ago
...it's your argument. Not on me to prove it for you!
- wly_cdgr 5y ago
  Sure. But I got better things to do than prove the obvious to people who don't want to believe it
  - exBarrelSpoiler 5y ago
    Then you cede the argument entirely.
Underphil 5y ago
If you release on GitHub you have no skin in the game. If you break something or abandon the project entirely (which happens with a breathtaking frequency) you can just move on to something else. Not the same at all.
drewcoo 5y ago
Aha. I disagreed with you until you made this point. Now I think I see where you're right and people are talking past each other. Art masterpieces are not built by committee. You list mostly what I'd consider arts. You claim that programming is (like) an art. And I think that's the difference. The opinion you're arguing against comes from the perspective that programming on a larger team to solve real world problems is (like) an engineering discipline. Engineering is both an art and a science, but more importantly engineering is a collaborative process. And that's why the focus of the piece was on social aspects of engineering and avoiding blame culture. We need better terms than were using. "Programming" is about as useful in this discussion as "building things with rock." Does that mean stacking cairns? Does that mean fine art sculpture? Does that mean designing highways and dams?

PeterisP 5y ago

Their entire argument against the great man theory, quoting the original article, is "But it’s also wrong, and toxic to sustainable development and equitable environments." No reasons or arguments are provided, just an assertion. On the other hand, "a lot of the very best software is made by either one person or a very small band of very close collaborators." is an argument - not very strong, but at least something, with prominent examples such as git, tex, Calibre, emacs, OBS, Minecraft, Stardew Valley, Sublime Text and many others.