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What do you expect him to say? He is in Russia. If he says something against the war in Ukraine, he is being arrested because it is illegal in Russia to be agai

by NoPie 5y ago

What do you expect him to say? He is in Russia. If he says something against the war in Ukraine, he is being arrested because it is illegal in Russia to be against the war, you are not allowed even to call it a war. If he is arrested, in the best case he will be deported and then goes to jail in the US. In the worst case, he is put in jail in Russia next to Navalniy. If he doesn't say anything, then apparently the only thing he wants to say is things against this war. There is nothing else for him to say. Therefore his silence means that he is strongly against the war.

mistersquid 5y ago
> What do you expect him to say? He is in Russia. Some call acting on principle with the understanding you may be imprisoned for doing so “having the courage of one’s convictions’. Snowden evaded extradition to the United States by residing in Russia. At present, he appears to be silent regarding the current state of Russia/Ukraine relations. Courage. Convictions.
- mrpf1ster 5y ago
  He acted on principle and conviction by whistleblowing. Look how far that got him. Easy to call for being courageous when your not the one facing life in prison.
  - mistersquid 5y ago
    > Easy to call for being courageous when your not the one facing life in prison. The ease with which one points out the courage of another’s convictions is distinct from the courage of the subject of attention.
    - DiggyJohnson 5y ago
      Yes, but it should still be accounted for in their answer. I read someone saying “Snowden isn’t courageous enough” and I think that this person does not have enough information and intimate knowledge to make such a statement. Not everybody needs to be a superhero on every issue.
- ncmncm 5y ago
  Courage of convictions is an ideal to impose on yourself. You don't get to impose it on anybody else. You don't know enough about anybody's situation except your own.
  - mistersquid 5y ago
    > Courage of convictions is an ideal to impose on yourself. You don't get to impose it on anybody else. With due respect, I politely disagree. One may call out anyone for meeting or failing the courage of their convictions.
    - ncmncm 5y ago
      Edward Snowden has already sacrificed far more than we can reasonably ask of anybody.
- nopenopenopeno 5y ago
  If Edward Snowden hasn’t illustrated enough conviction to meet your standards, I am aching to learn who has. He sacrificed his entire livelihood for his fellow Americans, yet whose most honorable efforts have still had no measurable political impact despite being the most important media story in the past decade, opting against sacrificing the fleeting bits of life he has left to call his own in the name of yet another unrelated cause. Realize you aren’t criticizing a questionable action of his. You’re just brazenly insisting that he do more to impress you. Where is the logic here?
  - mistersquid 5y ago
    I am not saying Snowden is not honorable. He has done the world a great service at great personal sacrifice. I implied he may not have the courage of his convictions regarding current events in Ukraine. Yes, I want more from Snowden. I know I am not entitled to more, but I still want it.
    - gus_massa 5y ago
      In the previous event his great personal sacrifice made a difference becasue he has some secret information. In this event, he has no information that is not widely available, so another great personal sacrifice will achieve nothing.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
    - more_corn 5y ago
      Speaking out publicly might not be the most effective course of action. Recall that his previous efforts exposed illegal, secret government programs. He collected evidence and then published it, bringing to light illegal programs that were previously not public. He didn’t just tweet uselessly, he provided extensive proof or illegal programs. Everyone knows Russia is conducting a blatant power and territory grab (except maybe the willfully ignorant). Snowden tweeting about it would teach us nothing new. Maybe if the US stopped persecuting him for publicizing our government’s illegal programs he’d be free to leave Russian and criticize their illegal actions.
- gruturo 5y ago
  He already showed his courage, and will likely end up in history books at some point - but he paid a very high price for that, and expecting more is very unreasonable of us. Let the man rest and enjoy the relative freedom and safety he has left, he did his part. Furthermore: If he wanted to say something in support of russia, he would have absolutely been able to. His silence is very eloquent to me.
- mattcwilson 5y ago
  I mean, what if it’s not about courage? What if it’s canniness? What if he realizes that the long run best way for him to advance his goals is to quietly ride this time out and prepare for the opportunities on the other side?
ayngg 5y ago
It is like some people actually want him to commit self righteous suicide for no benefit to anyone besides some tweet saying nothing more than "Russia sucks lol" to satiate the selfish desires of outspoken protestors. I wonder how many of those people would be virtuous enough to bear the costs in his place to allow him to speak out.
joering2 5y ago
> he is being arrested because it is illegal in Russia to be against the war do you have any source to support this? I went thru most "Criminal Code of Russia" searching for anything related to war, and could not find anything in terms of even temporary jail time for speaking out against war. Many people do, in Russia, including politicians of Putin opposition and they are nor being jailed. Looks like you can get jailed for participating in a protest against war or basically against anything in Russia... but nobody is going to bother going after you because you have posted a mean tweet. And if you search Twitter there are thousands of anti-war anti-Putin tweets from Russian accounts posted for years and these accounts keep being acting and keep posting (from jail I assume???).
- NoPie 5y ago
  https://globalcheck.net/en https://globalcheck.net/en twitter.com is not available in Russia. I suppose some people use VPN to access twitter. Even google.com gave instructions to Russian translators to not call war a war fearing the safety of their workers in Russia.
- chayleaf 5y ago
  See КоАП РФ 20.3.3 and УК РФ 207.3, passed in March. You won't be jailed for a single tweet denouncing the war - but you will likely get up to a $1k fine if you are reported (and since around half of Russians support the war it isn't that unlikely you WILL get reported). If you are more politically active, you can get visitors irl (police coming to your house, or just random pro-government activists doing vandalism around your house/flat). Additionally, spreading "fake news" can get you up to 15 years in jail (but most people "only" qualify for 3 years). By the way, I'm Russian, so feel free to ask me further questions about the overall situation.
  - joering2 5y ago
    that's insane! who the heck pass this as a law?? do you guys know names of these people? how come you cannot vote them out of office? my heart goes out to all Russians on the right side of history...

by NoPie 5y ago

mistersquid 5y ago

> What do you expect him to say? He is in Russia. Some call acting on principle with the understanding you may be imprisoned for doing so “having the courage of one’s convictions’. Snowden evaded extradition to the United States by residing in Russia. At present, he appears to be silent regarding the current state of Russia/Ukraine relations. Courage. Convictions.

mrpf1ster 5y ago
He acted on principle and conviction by whistleblowing. Look how far that got him. Easy to call for being courageous when your not the one facing life in prison.
- mistersquid 5y ago
  > Easy to call for being courageous when your not the one facing life in prison. The ease with which one points out the courage of another’s convictions is distinct from the courage of the subject of attention.
  - DiggyJohnson 5y ago
    Yes, but it should still be accounted for in their answer. I read someone saying “Snowden isn’t courageous enough” and I think that this person does not have enough information and intimate knowledge to make such a statement. Not everybody needs to be a superhero on every issue.
ncmncm 5y ago
Courage of convictions is an ideal to impose on yourself. You don't get to impose it on anybody else. You don't know enough about anybody's situation except your own.
- mistersquid 5y ago
  > Courage of convictions is an ideal to impose on yourself. You don't get to impose it on anybody else. With due respect, I politely disagree. One may call out anyone for meeting or failing the courage of their convictions.
  - ncmncm 5y ago
    Edward Snowden has already sacrificed far more than we can reasonably ask of anybody.
nopenopenopeno 5y ago
If Edward Snowden hasn’t illustrated enough conviction to meet your standards, I am aching to learn who has. He sacrificed his entire livelihood for his fellow Americans, yet whose most honorable efforts have still had no measurable political impact despite being the most important media story in the past decade, opting against sacrificing the fleeting bits of life he has left to call his own in the name of yet another unrelated cause. Realize you aren’t criticizing a questionable action of his. You’re just brazenly insisting that he do more to impress you. Where is the logic here?
- mistersquid 5y ago
  I am not saying Snowden is not honorable. He has done the world a great service at great personal sacrifice. I implied he may not have the courage of his convictions regarding current events in Ukraine. Yes, I want more from Snowden. I know I am not entitled to more, but I still want it.
  - gus_massa 5y ago
    In the previous event his great personal sacrifice made a difference becasue he has some secret information. In this event, he has no information that is not widely available, so another great personal sacrifice will achieve nothing.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
  - more_corn 5y ago
    Speaking out publicly might not be the most effective course of action. Recall that his previous efforts exposed illegal, secret government programs. He collected evidence and then published it, bringing to light illegal programs that were previously not public. He didn’t just tweet uselessly, he provided extensive proof or illegal programs. Everyone knows Russia is conducting a blatant power and territory grab (except maybe the willfully ignorant). Snowden tweeting about it would teach us nothing new. Maybe if the US stopped persecuting him for publicizing our government’s illegal programs he’d be free to leave Russian and criticize their illegal actions.
gruturo 5y ago
He already showed his courage, and will likely end up in history books at some point - but he paid a very high price for that, and expecting more is very unreasonable of us. Let the man rest and enjoy the relative freedom and safety he has left, he did his part. Furthermore: If he wanted to say something in support of russia, he would have absolutely been able to. His silence is very eloquent to me.
mattcwilson 5y ago
I mean, what if it’s not about courage? What if it’s canniness? What if he realizes that the long run best way for him to advance his goals is to quietly ride this time out and prepare for the opportunities on the other side?

ayngg 5y ago

It is like some people actually want him to commit self righteous suicide for no benefit to anyone besides some tweet saying nothing more than "Russia sucks lol" to satiate the selfish desires of outspoken protestors. I wonder how many of those people would be virtuous enough to bear the costs in his place to allow him to speak out.

joering2 5y ago

> he is being arrested because it is illegal in Russia to be against the war do you have any source to support this? I went thru most "Criminal Code of Russia" searching for anything related to war, and could not find anything in terms of even temporary jail time for speaking out against war. Many people do, in Russia, including politicians of Putin opposition and they are nor being jailed. Looks like you can get jailed for participating in a protest against war or basically against anything in Russia... but nobody is going to bother going after you because you have posted a mean tweet. And if you search Twitter there are thousands of anti-war anti-Putin tweets from Russian accounts posted for years and these accounts keep being acting and keep posting (from jail I assume???).

NoPie 5y ago
https://globalcheck.net/en https://globalcheck.net/en twitter.com is not available in Russia. I suppose some people use VPN to access twitter. Even google.com gave instructions to Russian translators to not call war a war fearing the safety of their workers in Russia.
chayleaf 5y ago
See КоАП РФ 20.3.3 and УК РФ 207.3, passed in March. You won't be jailed for a single tweet denouncing the war - but you will likely get up to a $1k fine if you are reported (and since around half of Russians support the war it isn't that unlikely you WILL get reported). If you are more politically active, you can get visitors irl (police coming to your house, or just random pro-government activists doing vandalism around your house/flat). Additionally, spreading "fake news" can get you up to 15 years in jail (but most people "only" qualify for 3 years). By the way, I'm Russian, so feel free to ask me further questions about the overall situation.
- joering2 5y ago
  that's insane! who the heck pass this as a law?? do you guys know names of these people? how come you cannot vote them out of office? my heart goes out to all Russians on the right side of history...