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I'm honestly not sure how Ubiquiti felt this was a smart idea; defamation lawsuits are notoriously difficult to win and in the vast majority of cases, result in

by gzer0 5y ago

I'm honestly not sure how Ubiquiti felt this was a smart idea; defamation lawsuits are notoriously difficult to win and in the vast majority of cases, result in greater damage to the plaintiff's image than before filing the lawsuit. Waste of everyone's time and money.

Enginerrrd 5y ago
Yup... it seems like everyone has turned on ubiquiti lately, but I wasn't totally convinced. I was holding out despite some of the irksome changes, but this move right here is a nail in the coffin for me.
- Someone1234 5y ago
  I'm on the same page. We just need to see a compelling alternative appear, and they'll lose their segment pretty quickly. Meraki could have been that until the Cisco acquisition and now $$$$ (and they make it extremely hard for SMBs/ProSumers to buy in). Some say that Aruba's "Instant On" stuff is one to keep your eye on as a direct replacement. Ever since they fired their domestic development staff and shipped those jobs overseas it has been getting worse and worse. And it isn't because foreign developers cannot develop, it is because the company then and since has prioritized cost (and flash half-baked features) over quality.
  - oseityphelysiol 5y ago
    No-one shipped jobs overseas. m of the teams at UI have always been and remain located in the EU.
  - heffer 5y ago
    > Meraki could have been that until the Cisco acquisition and now $$$$ (and they make it extremely hard for SMBs/ProSumers to buy in). Meraki competes against Ubiquiti and Aruba InstantOn with Meraki Go, not mainline Meraki.
- Lightbody 5y ago
  I'm in the same boat. The issue is... what great alternatives are there? I'm not interesting in investing the time required with pfsense / custom stuff. I want a similar experience to Ubiquity... does it exist?
  - jaywalk 5y ago
    I did a bunch of research when all of this first came out with the intention of moving off Ubiquiti and found nothing worthwhile. I'm in the same boat, no interest in the time/money investment to roll my own solution. Aside from one UDM Pro software update that enabled a schedule to disable my WiFi out of the blue, I haven't had any issues with my stuff. So I continue on with them.
  - hackmiester 5y ago
    pfSense doesn’t require much time for a basic setup. Stick with defaults, roll out some Ruckus Unleashed APs, and you are done.
Someone1234 5y ago
Maybe the point isn't to win but for the "chilling effect."[0]. Essentially to discourage critics of the company from raising criticism in the future for fear of lawsuit (even if ultimately just to waste legal costs/impose a burden). [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chilling_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chilling_effect
- gruturo 5y ago
  Chilling effect, meet Streisand effect: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect Thanks to Ubiquiti's efforts, now the story is known to a larger audience.
- TheHypnotist 5y ago
  It seems to basically be a SLAPP suit.
- robocat 5y ago
  Chilling effect meet Krebs. Krebs is more than capable of searching for security flaws. I would not want to piss him off . . . He seems like the sort of person to take it personally and then go out of his way to find security issues, of which I am sure there are plenty, considering the breadth of software and firmware across all their devices. This is not a symmetric fight.
InTheArena 5y ago
You do realize that the entire "ubiquiti sucks" mood on HN started with the publications of these (factually inaccurate) articles from Krebs? This whole thing pisses me off. A insider threatened a company with reputational damage and used a press guy to pull it up. HN picked it up and amplified it. Press guy never corrected the story, and the here we are - with people still railing on HN for a untrue story that the press guy enable that the extortionist planted.
- brightball 5y ago
  Their stock dropped by about 30% after that as well didn’t it?
- draw_down 5y ago
  Well, if you think you might be having a reputational problem, sue someone for defamation. That way you remove all doubt.
- newsclues 5y ago
  Yeah I’m also pissed off that they failed to have policy in place to prevent an insider threat and deal with it afterwards.
  - InTheArena 5y ago
    It's almost impossible to prevent a trusted insider attack. It is possible to quickly identify and shut down a insider. I think the second is a bigger issue - they did (obv) identify the attacker - but they had the FBI involved at that point.
    - GekkePrutser 5y ago
      No it's virtually impossible to prevent it. It's very important to detect it though and to have a playbook in place on how to deal with it.
      - newsclues 5y ago
jamesliudotcc 5y ago
There is a term for this, the "Streisand effect." It turns out, there can be such a thing as bad publicity. And like all forms of publicity, there are ways of putting it into a positive feedback loop. (Positive in the sense that you get more of it, perhaps from your perspective it is a positive development, perhaps not).

by gzer0 5y ago

Enginerrrd 5y ago

Yup... it seems like everyone has turned on ubiquiti lately, but I wasn't totally convinced. I was holding out despite some of the irksome changes, but this move right here is a nail in the coffin for me.

Someone1234 5y ago
I'm on the same page. We just need to see a compelling alternative appear, and they'll lose their segment pretty quickly. Meraki could have been that until the Cisco acquisition and now $$$$ (and they make it extremely hard for SMBs/ProSumers to buy in). Some say that Aruba's "Instant On" stuff is one to keep your eye on as a direct replacement. Ever since they fired their domestic development staff and shipped those jobs overseas it has been getting worse and worse. And it isn't because foreign developers cannot develop, it is because the company then and since has prioritized cost (and flash half-baked features) over quality.
- oseityphelysiol 5y ago
  No-one shipped jobs overseas. m of the teams at UI have always been and remain located in the EU.
- heffer 5y ago
  > Meraki could have been that until the Cisco acquisition and now $$$$ (and they make it extremely hard for SMBs/ProSumers to buy in). Meraki competes against Ubiquiti and Aruba InstantOn with Meraki Go, not mainline Meraki.
Lightbody 5y ago
I'm in the same boat. The issue is... what great alternatives are there? I'm not interesting in investing the time required with pfsense / custom stuff. I want a similar experience to Ubiquity... does it exist?
- jaywalk 5y ago
  I did a bunch of research when all of this first came out with the intention of moving off Ubiquiti and found nothing worthwhile. I'm in the same boat, no interest in the time/money investment to roll my own solution. Aside from one UDM Pro software update that enabled a schedule to disable my WiFi out of the blue, I haven't had any issues with my stuff. So I continue on with them.
- hackmiester 5y ago
  pfSense doesn’t require much time for a basic setup. Stick with defaults, roll out some Ruckus Unleashed APs, and you are done.

Someone1234 5y ago

Maybe the point isn't to win but for the "chilling effect."[0]. Essentially to discourage critics of the company from raising criticism in the future for fear of lawsuit (even if ultimately just to waste legal costs/impose a burden). [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chilling_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chilling_effect

gruturo 5y ago
Chilling effect, meet Streisand effect: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect Thanks to Ubiquiti's efforts, now the story is known to a larger audience.
TheHypnotist 5y ago
It seems to basically be a SLAPP suit.
robocat 5y ago
Chilling effect meet Krebs. Krebs is more than capable of searching for security flaws. I would not want to piss him off . . . He seems like the sort of person to take it personally and then go out of his way to find security issues, of which I am sure there are plenty, considering the breadth of software and firmware across all their devices. This is not a symmetric fight.

InTheArena 5y ago

You do realize that the entire "ubiquiti sucks" mood on HN started with the publications of these (factually inaccurate) articles from Krebs? This whole thing pisses me off. A insider threatened a company with reputational damage and used a press guy to pull it up. HN picked it up and amplified it. Press guy never corrected the story, and the here we are - with people still railing on HN for a untrue story that the press guy enable that the extortionist planted.

brightball 5y ago
Their stock dropped by about 30% after that as well didn’t it?
draw_down 5y ago
Well, if you think you might be having a reputational problem, sue someone for defamation. That way you remove all doubt.
newsclues 5y ago
Yeah I’m also pissed off that they failed to have policy in place to prevent an insider threat and deal with it afterwards.
- InTheArena 5y ago
  It's almost impossible to prevent a trusted insider attack. It is possible to quickly identify and shut down a insider. I think the second is a bigger issue - they did (obv) identify the attacker - but they had the FBI involved at that point.
  - GekkePrutser 5y ago
    No it's virtually impossible to prevent it. It's very important to detect it though and to have a playbook in place on how to deal with it.
    - newsclues 5y ago

jamesliudotcc 5y ago

There is a term for this, the "Streisand effect." It turns out, there can be such a thing as bad publicity. And like all forms of publicity, there are ways of putting it into a positive feedback loop. (Positive in the sense that you get more of it, perhaps from your perspective it is a positive development, perhaps not).