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Why is it hyperbolic and why is it naive? It was a tool used to influence elections in the United States, I can't think of any other entity that has had a larg

Why is it hyperbolic and why is it naive? It was a tool used to influence elections in the United States, I can't think of any other entity that has had a larger negative impact on our society recently (maybe coronavirus?).

Jackpillar 5y ago
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bko 5y ago
> It was a tool used to influence elections in the United States Are you talking about fake Russian accounts buying $100k worth of facebook ads in 2016? That constitutes 0.00625% of total spending (1.6 bn) on the 2016 election. Or are you talking about something else? https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/facebook-sold-100000-ads-fake-russian-accounts-presidential/story?id=49667831 https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/facebook-sold-100000-ads-fak...
- martingoodson 5y ago
  The IRA Russian troll farm had 1000 employees in 2015. They used Facebook as a tool to influence elections in the United States. This is very well documented https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Research_Agency https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Research_Agency And I don’t know why the sister comment about Facebook being used to commit genocide in Myanmar was flagged and killed. This is also well documented by eg the NYT and the UN. It was also admitted by Facebook itself. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/06/technology/myanmar-facebook.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/06/technology/myanmar-facebo...
- tracker1 5y ago
  It swings in every direction. Not just what they allow in terms of ads but what gets suppressed, promoted, shown/reshown. Visibility and not.
jessaustin 5y ago
Nothing in Russia is in any sense a "great threat to Western society".
- michaelmrose 5y ago
  They have recently threatened to murder all of western society with nuclear weapons should it choose to intercede to prevent the mass murder they are presently perpetrating upon the old folks women and children of one of their neighbors while discussing the possibility of perpetrating further mass murders against its other neighbors. The only saving grace is that this is probably but not certainly a bluff.
  - jessaustin 5y ago
    I don't think anyone on my TV really believes that nuclear war is a thing that can happen? If they thought it could happen, surely they wouldn't constantly argue for escalating conflict? Surely they don't really want to melt everyone's children? That seems very antisocial?! Ukraine is not part of "western society". Numerous Western politicians have had off-mic moments in which they admitted that dangling NATO membership was only ever meant to bait Ukraine and Russia into a ruinous proxy war. Which has now occurred.
    - michaelmrose 5y ago
      > Numerous Western politicians have had off-mic moments in which they admitted that dangling NATO membership was only ever meant to bait Ukraine and Russia into a ruinous proxy war. Which has now occurred. Please don't spread conspiracy theories.
      - jessaustin 5y ago
        Just because Zelensky said it, don't assume it's a "conspiracy theory". [0] Or, for that matter, that theories about conspiracies aren't true. Power-hungry bastards do conspire, regularly. [0] https://edition.cnn.com/europe/live-news/ukraine-russia-putin-news-03-20-22/h_7c08d64201fdd9d3a141e63e606a62e4 https://edition.cnn.com/europe/live-news/ukraine-russia-puti...
michaelmrose 5y ago
Arguably Facebooks help in spreading misinformation is to a large degree behind the Republican success in 2016. Tipping an unpopular president from too unpopular to win the popular vote to one which could at least win the electoral college. This ultimately led to gross mismanagement of the pandemic when it was most vital leading to hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths. In order to have a larger negative effect on society each and every Facebook engineer would have to personally conduct a mass shooting. Edit: In support of this position consider that the 2016 election was arguably lost entirely based on 78,000 votes in the rust belt. Basically based on 1/20th of 1% of voter turn out. Some sources put the number of unnecessary covid deaths in 2020 at around 200k deaths. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/02/lancet-study-40-percent-u-s-covid-19-coronavirus-deaths-avoidable-unnecessary.html https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/02/lancet-study-40-... Other sources put the number of software engineers at around 8850 https://www.daxx.com/blog/development-trends/number-software-developers-world https://www.daxx.com/blog/development-trends/number-software... The number of unnecessary covid deaths per Facebook software engineer is ergo about 23. Looking at stats from the FBI from 2000 - 2018 884 were killed in 277 incidents meaning the average shooter only managed to kill about 3 people. https://www.fbi.gov/about/partnerships/office-of-partner-engagement/active-shooter-incidents-graphics https://www.fbi.gov/about/partnerships/office-of-partner-eng... Nearly every nut bar I know personally who is radicalized was first radicalized on facebook before sometimes moving on to other platforms. Facebook engineers by the numbers are actually far more effective at killing folks than the average shooter. Your choice of employment isn't moral nor is it morally neutral to just write code. Individuals in high demand who could work nearly anywhere ought to consider working somewhere more ethical.

Jackpillar 5y ago

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bko 5y ago

> It was a tool used to influence elections in the United States Are you talking about fake Russian accounts buying $100k worth of facebook ads in 2016? That constitutes 0.00625% of total spending (1.6 bn) on the 2016 election. Or are you talking about something else? https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/facebook-sold-100000-ads-fake-russian-accounts-presidential/story?id=49667831 https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/facebook-sold-100000-ads-fak...

martingoodson 5y ago
The IRA Russian troll farm had 1000 employees in 2015. They used Facebook as a tool to influence elections in the United States. This is very well documented https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Research_Agency https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Research_Agency And I don’t know why the sister comment about Facebook being used to commit genocide in Myanmar was flagged and killed. This is also well documented by eg the NYT and the UN. It was also admitted by Facebook itself. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/06/technology/myanmar-facebook.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/06/technology/myanmar-facebo...
tracker1 5y ago
It swings in every direction. Not just what they allow in terms of ads but what gets suppressed, promoted, shown/reshown. Visibility and not.

jessaustin 5y ago

Nothing in Russia is in any sense a "great threat to Western society".

michaelmrose 5y ago
They have recently threatened to murder all of western society with nuclear weapons should it choose to intercede to prevent the mass murder they are presently perpetrating upon the old folks women and children of one of their neighbors while discussing the possibility of perpetrating further mass murders against its other neighbors. The only saving grace is that this is probably but not certainly a bluff.
- jessaustin 5y ago
  I don't think anyone on my TV really believes that nuclear war is a thing that can happen? If they thought it could happen, surely they wouldn't constantly argue for escalating conflict? Surely they don't really want to melt everyone's children? That seems very antisocial?! Ukraine is not part of "western society". Numerous Western politicians have had off-mic moments in which they admitted that dangling NATO membership was only ever meant to bait Ukraine and Russia into a ruinous proxy war. Which has now occurred.
  - michaelmrose 5y ago
    > Numerous Western politicians have had off-mic moments in which they admitted that dangling NATO membership was only ever meant to bait Ukraine and Russia into a ruinous proxy war. Which has now occurred. Please don't spread conspiracy theories.
    - jessaustin 5y ago
      Just because Zelensky said it, don't assume it's a "conspiracy theory". [0] Or, for that matter, that theories about conspiracies aren't true. Power-hungry bastards do conspire, regularly. [0] https://edition.cnn.com/europe/live-news/ukraine-russia-putin-news-03-20-22/h_7c08d64201fdd9d3a141e63e606a62e4 https://edition.cnn.com/europe/live-news/ukraine-russia-puti...

michaelmrose 5y ago

Arguably Facebooks help in spreading misinformation is to a large degree behind the Republican success in 2016. Tipping an unpopular president from too unpopular to win the popular vote to one which could at least win the electoral college. This ultimately led to gross mismanagement of the pandemic when it was most vital leading to hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths. In order to have a larger negative effect on society each and every Facebook engineer would have to personally conduct a mass shooting. Edit: In support of this position consider that the 2016 election was arguably lost entirely based on 78,000 votes in the rust belt. Basically based on 1/20th of 1% of voter turn out. Some sources put the number of unnecessary covid deaths in 2020 at around 200k deaths. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/02/lancet-study-40-percent-u-s-covid-19-coronavirus-deaths-avoidable-unnecessary.html https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/02/lancet-study-40-... Other sources put the number of software engineers at around 8850 https://www.daxx.com/blog/development-trends/number-software-developers-world https://www.daxx.com/blog/development-trends/number-software... The number of unnecessary covid deaths per Facebook software engineer is ergo about 23. Looking at stats from the FBI from 2000 - 2018 884 were killed in 277 incidents meaning the average shooter only managed to kill about 3 people. https://www.fbi.gov/about/partnerships/office-of-partner-engagement/active-shooter-incidents-graphics https://www.fbi.gov/about/partnerships/office-of-partner-eng... Nearly every nut bar I know personally who is radicalized was first radicalized on facebook before sometimes moving on to other platforms. Facebook engineers by the numbers are actually far more effective at killing folks than the average shooter. Your choice of employment isn't moral nor is it morally neutral to just write code. Individuals in high demand who could work nearly anywhere ought to consider working somewhere more ethical.