32 ms·

> Big difference between board members and stockholders. Completely agree, but in small/medium size companies (no public stock etc), these are often the same p

> Big difference between board members and stockholders. Completely agree, but in small/medium size companies (no public stock etc), these are often the same people. In many cases it's completely obvious who (which humans) that have done something wrong, but since we still accept that the legal entity under which they operated no longer exists; you're stuck. A problem where I live (Norway) has been that people register companies to build apartment buildings, then immediately dissolve the company once the apartments are sold. The people who buy those flats better pray that there is nothing wrong with them, as there is basically nowhere to turn if there is.

jacquesm 5y ago
In such cases, where it is totally clear that the people in charge of that business acted in bad faith I'm all for going after them in person. A good building company either insures against such risks or they create a warranty fund. An even worse example would be a builder going bankrupt during the building. This is one of the reasons I've never bought a new house, it either exists and you can sell it to me or you can try to sell it to someone else first but I'm not going to assume that kind of risk.
- bjarneh 5y ago
  > acted in bad faith I'm all for going after them in person I agree, but this should be standard procedure. Hiding behind these peculiar "legal entities" that cannot possibly be held accountable anyway, makes no sense. > This is one of the reasons I've never bought a new house Same here, although the house I did buy was 160 years old; which also comes with its own set of problems :-)
  - jacquesm 5y ago
    > although the house I did buy was 160 years old; which also comes with its own set of problems Hehe, been there done that. In fact, doing that, right now I'm fixing a window frame that had 'a small spot of rot', by the time it was done half the frame had been removed, incredible how bad wood can be under nicely looking paint. Insect paradise underneath there.
    - bjarneh 5y ago
      > 'a small spot of rot' is similar to "a small spot of rust" I guess, there is no such thing :-) Fascinating to see how these old tree constructions are made. I still find it hard to comprehend that a few bricks and some timber logs are all that separates me from living directly on the dirt like a cave man..
      - jacquesm 5y ago
        That's one of my dreams still, to build a post-and-beam house from scratch. But I'm getting older and it may well be that such ambitious projects are now out of reach for me.
        bjarneh 5y ago
        > to build a post-and-beam house from scratch Sound like fun, and you shouldn't let age stop you from doing that. Instead you should adjust your dream to building a smaller post-and-beam house. It's not back breaking work if it's a small house; our inner cave men wants to work with timber for some reason.
robertlagrant 5y ago
> The people who buy those flats better pray that there is nothing wrong with them, as there is basically nowhere to turn if there is This is also the case if you buy from a human.
- jacquesm 5y ago
  That's not strictly speaking true. If the human was aware of what was wrong with it prior to the sale and did not inform you then you can typically file a claim against them in court ('hidden defect'). You still have to prove that you did what a normal buyer would do in terms of research but malice on the part of the seller is something that is actionable.
- bjarneh 5y ago
  > This is also the case if you buy from a human. This used to be the case here in Norway until 2021 as well, but now it's illegal to slap the old "sold-as-it-is" clause at the end of the contract. You can still sell horrible stuff of course, but you have to say that it's horrible, in the listing :-)
orra 5y ago
Here in the UK, most new builds come with 10 years of buildings insurance. That's good, because I've heard horror stories about the quality of new builds. I imagine the insurance premiums are quite high, to guard against such 'fly by night' operations.

jacquesm 5y ago

In such cases, where it is totally clear that the people in charge of that business acted in bad faith I'm all for going after them in person. A good building company either insures against such risks or they create a warranty fund. An even worse example would be a builder going bankrupt during the building. This is one of the reasons I've never bought a new house, it either exists and you can sell it to me or you can try to sell it to someone else first but I'm not going to assume that kind of risk.

bjarneh 5y ago
> acted in bad faith I'm all for going after them in person I agree, but this should be standard procedure. Hiding behind these peculiar "legal entities" that cannot possibly be held accountable anyway, makes no sense. > This is one of the reasons I've never bought a new house Same here, although the house I did buy was 160 years old; which also comes with its own set of problems :-)
- jacquesm 5y ago
  > although the house I did buy was 160 years old; which also comes with its own set of problems Hehe, been there done that. In fact, doing that, right now I'm fixing a window frame that had 'a small spot of rot', by the time it was done half the frame had been removed, incredible how bad wood can be under nicely looking paint. Insect paradise underneath there.
  - bjarneh 5y ago
    > 'a small spot of rot' is similar to "a small spot of rust" I guess, there is no such thing :-) Fascinating to see how these old tree constructions are made. I still find it hard to comprehend that a few bricks and some timber logs are all that separates me from living directly on the dirt like a cave man..
    - jacquesm 5y ago
      That's one of my dreams still, to build a post-and-beam house from scratch. But I'm getting older and it may well be that such ambitious projects are now out of reach for me.
      - bjarneh 5y ago
        > to build a post-and-beam house from scratch Sound like fun, and you shouldn't let age stop you from doing that. Instead you should adjust your dream to building a smaller post-and-beam house. It's not back breaking work if it's a small house; our inner cave men wants to work with timber for some reason.

robertlagrant 5y ago

> The people who buy those flats better pray that there is nothing wrong with them, as there is basically nowhere to turn if there is This is also the case if you buy from a human.

jacquesm 5y ago
That's not strictly speaking true. If the human was aware of what was wrong with it prior to the sale and did not inform you then you can typically file a claim against them in court ('hidden defect'). You still have to prove that you did what a normal buyer would do in terms of research but malice on the part of the seller is something that is actionable.
bjarneh 5y ago
> This is also the case if you buy from a human. This used to be the case here in Norway until 2021 as well, but now it's illegal to slap the old "sold-as-it-is" clause at the end of the contract. You can still sell horrible stuff of course, but you have to say that it's horrible, in the listing :-)

orra 5y ago

Here in the UK, most new builds come with 10 years of buildings insurance. That's good, because I've heard horror stories about the quality of new builds. I imagine the insurance premiums are quite high, to guard against such 'fly by night' operations.