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I have a $165k notice of defiecency bill from the IRS due next month that is a complete joke that I have had to spend days figuring out. I almost dropped thousa

by swozey 5y ago

I have a $165k notice of defiecency bill from the IRS due next month that is a complete joke that I have had to spend days figuring out. I almost dropped thousands on a lawyer for it until I understood Tax Court better. Why? They think I sold a house and kept all of the gains. Like I didn't have a mortgage, and like it wasn't my primary residence. It's ridiculous. I can't explain how stressed out getting a $165k bill when that's practically my yearly income made me. I wonder how many wealthy people get these completely incorrect $165k bills and how often they come after the person with $10k in the bank.

rossjudson 5y ago
I highly recommend that you keep everything related to this, securely, for several years even after it is resolved. State governments are not necessarily believing the same set of facts that the federal government does. I got caught in a multi-year cycle one time where the state government kept coming after me every year for the same thing, even though I had the federal return and the evidence that it was correct. Each year I'd send that thing in, in response, and I'd never hear from them...until the next year, when they'd do it again. Felt to me like each year somebody would receive my response, decide it was too much work to deal with, and then file it away in the "hit them again next year" pile.
- swozey 5y ago
  Thanks. Like you, nobody has ever responded to me other than them "upgrading" me from being able to prove my taxes via fax to having to petition the tax court directly. I'm sure this will be a nightmare for the next few years. As if selling that house wasn't a bad enough experience. I shouldn't have to spend $5k or whatever else on a lawyer to deal with this. Insane. I walked away with $13k after paying everyone/mortgage off.
toast0 5y ago
Did you report the sale? When I sold my primary residence in 2018, it ended up on Schedule D and Form 8949, and there were no questions asked. The IRS does have a tendency to assume zero basis when there's a capital sale reported to them that doesn't appear in the tax return; which makes for scary bills, but can usually be resolved by reporting the sale and your basis on the appropriate form. (although I see from further replies that you are now having to deal with this in Tax Court, so that sounds like a terrible time, and I'm sorry for your tedium)
- swozey 5y ago
  I don't believe I did, it was my primary residence so bypassing a lot of the tax implications from capital gains. It was my first house sale so I was really expecting to companies involved in it that I paid a small fortune to to handle things of that nature, or at least send me documentation to send when I did my taxes. Unless something got lost in the mail I never received any sort of tax docs, which in my obvious-now ignorance might have been very wrong. I did these taxes in the height of the pandemic in March after being laid off and living out of airbnbs for 3 months so it very well may have just been missed unfortunately. I'm not even sure what they need or who to talk to, I'm just going to mail them everything I have including the Statute stating I don't need to pay capital gains on a primary residence house sale under $500k.
  - toast0 5y ago
    I'm not a tax person, but probably all they need is an amended tax return (1040X) with the sale reported. Grab the instructions for schedule D for the tax year you sold your home, and follow the section for "Sale of Your Home". It says you're only required to report the sale if the gains exceeded the exclusion amount or you received a 1099-S; but I'm guessing the IRS must have received a 1099-S even if you didn't. You might be able to get a copy of that through the IRS Tax Transcript service? They probably don't need a copy of the Statute, but eh. :)
    - swozey 5y ago
      I appreciate this, thank you.
    - swozey 5y ago
      Just as an update, apparently it takes 1-3 months for docs to the IRS to make it to where they're supposed to go. I just got off the phone w/them (took 1hr:45mins to get a person) and found out I only owe $20 after faxing them my house sale docs in November! What a weight off my back..

by swozey 5y ago

rossjudson 5y ago

I highly recommend that you keep everything related to this, securely, for several years even after it is resolved. State governments are not necessarily believing the same set of facts that the federal government does. I got caught in a multi-year cycle one time where the state government kept coming after me every year for the same thing, even though I had the federal return and the evidence that it was correct. Each year I'd send that thing in, in response, and I'd never hear from them...until the next year, when they'd do it again. Felt to me like each year somebody would receive my response, decide it was too much work to deal with, and then file it away in the "hit them again next year" pile.

swozey 5y ago
Thanks. Like you, nobody has ever responded to me other than them "upgrading" me from being able to prove my taxes via fax to having to petition the tax court directly. I'm sure this will be a nightmare for the next few years. As if selling that house wasn't a bad enough experience. I shouldn't have to spend $5k or whatever else on a lawyer to deal with this. Insane. I walked away with $13k after paying everyone/mortgage off.

toast0 5y ago

Did you report the sale? When I sold my primary residence in 2018, it ended up on Schedule D and Form 8949, and there were no questions asked. The IRS does have a tendency to assume zero basis when there's a capital sale reported to them that doesn't appear in the tax return; which makes for scary bills, but can usually be resolved by reporting the sale and your basis on the appropriate form. (although I see from further replies that you are now having to deal with this in Tax Court, so that sounds like a terrible time, and I'm sorry for your tedium)

swozey 5y ago
I don't believe I did, it was my primary residence so bypassing a lot of the tax implications from capital gains. It was my first house sale so I was really expecting to companies involved in it that I paid a small fortune to to handle things of that nature, or at least send me documentation to send when I did my taxes. Unless something got lost in the mail I never received any sort of tax docs, which in my obvious-now ignorance might have been very wrong. I did these taxes in the height of the pandemic in March after being laid off and living out of airbnbs for 3 months so it very well may have just been missed unfortunately. I'm not even sure what they need or who to talk to, I'm just going to mail them everything I have including the Statute stating I don't need to pay capital gains on a primary residence house sale under $500k.
- toast0 5y ago
  I'm not a tax person, but probably all they need is an amended tax return (1040X) with the sale reported. Grab the instructions for schedule D for the tax year you sold your home, and follow the section for "Sale of Your Home". It says you're only required to report the sale if the gains exceeded the exclusion amount or you received a 1099-S; but I'm guessing the IRS must have received a 1099-S even if you didn't. You might be able to get a copy of that through the IRS Tax Transcript service? They probably don't need a copy of the Statute, but eh. :)
  - swozey 5y ago
    I appreciate this, thank you.
  - swozey 5y ago
    Just as an update, apparently it takes 1-3 months for docs to the IRS to make it to where they're supposed to go. I just got off the phone w/them (took 1hr:45mins to get a person) and found out I only owe $20 after faxing them my house sale docs in November! What a weight off my back..