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>paying individual people as a direct incentive to reduce their own carbon output Is there anything you can spend this money on that is not produced using foss

by ux-app 5y ago

>paying individual people as a direct incentive to reduce their own carbon output Is there anything you can spend this money on that is not produced using fossil fuels?

mattcwilson 5y ago
Music, art, books, comedy, pets, food, land, clothing, shelter... provided it’s all locally produced, I suppose. Are you going after something in particular? Seriously not trying to be facetious - I just don’t understand where you’re headed with this glib? rhetorical? question.
- ux-app 5y ago
  Wasn't a glib comment, I think almost everything is either produced or consumed with the help of fossil fuels. >Music, art, books, comedy, pets, food, land, clothing, shelter. Every one of these requires fossil fuel input to some degree. Music: Every instrument, music player whatever is produced using plastics and fossil fules. books: Dead trees? Fossil fuels. Kindle? Plastics from fossil fuels food: produced and distributed using fossil fuels clothing: produced and distributed using fossil fuels You see where I'm going with this? It's impossible to live a fossil fuel neutral existence in a modern world
  - mattcwilson 5y ago
    I don’t think it’s impossible? I think there’s a question of what fossil-fuel dependent comforts you’re willing to give up. But I assure you it’s entirely possible to live and have all of those goods, today, fossil-fuel free.
    - ux-app 5y ago
      >But I assure you it’s entirely possible to live and have all of those goods, today, fossil-fuel free Well I'd be curious to hear how. Even the apple in your pantry requires significant fossil fuel input. Fertilizer: Fossil fuel based - the Haber-Bosch process is now directly responsible for sustaining 40% of the Earth’s population and is reliant on natural gas. That's to say nothing of the transport involved in, for example, buying Avocado year round from your grocer. That's just food though. Plastics are in literally everything. The amount of plastics, glues etc just in the pair of shoes you wear every day is unreal.
      - nonrandomstring 5y ago
        Sorry to play the man and not the ball, and please don't take this as as personal ad-hominem, but what you are doing is rationalised catastrophising [1] Your fallacy is: Because all things are X and some X are bad, all X are equally bad. Your game is: Whatever you think of as a humane activity, I can find a reason why it's destroying the planet so you may as well not bother - just continue destroying the planet as you are. Fact is, everything you do will kill you. Every step you take wears out your body. Every bite of food and breath of oxygen takes you further down the road to death. What will you do, stay in bed frozen in fear? There are a billion things to do in life that have less environmental impact than flying around the world to go a jet-ski racing and tyre burning party. Reading a good book [2] :) on a beach would hurt less. respects [1] https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/catastrophizing https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/catastrophizing [2] https://digitalvegan.net https://digitalvegan.net
        ux-app 5y ago
        >Whatever you think of as a humane activity, I can find a reason why it's destroying the planet so you may as well not bother - just continue destroying the planet as you are yes that's correct, there is nothing you can personally do that will make a measurable difference to making the planet a better place. You're wasting your time. Even collective action is probably doomed. There are just too many humans on the planet. In 1500, the world population was 460million. That is probably a level that the planet can indefinitely sustain. We're at 8billion now and we're fatally addicted to fossil fuels. Buying local and taking a bus to work are not going to save the planet.
      - mattcwilson 5y ago
        > Well I'd be curious to hear how. A lot of hard work, non vehicular labor, local sourcing, and luck, providence, perseverance, and serendipity. How do you suppose humans did it prior to the invention of the coal mine and oil drill? Once again - not trying to be facetious or patronizing; just legitimately answering the request.
        5y ago

by ux-app 5y ago

>paying individual people as a direct incentive to reduce their own carbon output Is there anything you can spend this money on that is not produced using fossil fuels?

mattcwilson 5y ago

Music, art, books, comedy, pets, food, land, clothing, shelter... provided it’s all locally produced, I suppose. Are you going after something in particular? Seriously not trying to be facetious - I just don’t understand where you’re headed with this glib? rhetorical? question.

ux-app 5y ago
Wasn't a glib comment, I think almost everything is either produced or consumed with the help of fossil fuels. >Music, art, books, comedy, pets, food, land, clothing, shelter. Every one of these requires fossil fuel input to some degree. Music: Every instrument, music player whatever is produced using plastics and fossil fules. books: Dead trees? Fossil fuels. Kindle? Plastics from fossil fuels food: produced and distributed using fossil fuels clothing: produced and distributed using fossil fuels You see where I'm going with this? It's impossible to live a fossil fuel neutral existence in a modern world
- mattcwilson 5y ago
  I don’t think it’s impossible? I think there’s a question of what fossil-fuel dependent comforts you’re willing to give up. But I assure you it’s entirely possible to live and have all of those goods, today, fossil-fuel free.
  - ux-app 5y ago
    >But I assure you it’s entirely possible to live and have all of those goods, today, fossil-fuel free Well I'd be curious to hear how. Even the apple in your pantry requires significant fossil fuel input. Fertilizer: Fossil fuel based - the Haber-Bosch process is now directly responsible for sustaining 40% of the Earth’s population and is reliant on natural gas. That's to say nothing of the transport involved in, for example, buying Avocado year round from your grocer. That's just food though. Plastics are in literally everything. The amount of plastics, glues etc just in the pair of shoes you wear every day is unreal.
    - nonrandomstring 5y ago
      Sorry to play the man and not the ball, and please don't take this as as personal ad-hominem, but what you are doing is rationalised catastrophising [1] Your fallacy is: Because all things are X and some X are bad, all X are equally bad. Your game is: Whatever you think of as a humane activity, I can find a reason why it's destroying the planet so you may as well not bother - just continue destroying the planet as you are. Fact is, everything you do will kill you. Every step you take wears out your body. Every bite of food and breath of oxygen takes you further down the road to death. What will you do, stay in bed frozen in fear? There are a billion things to do in life that have less environmental impact than flying around the world to go a jet-ski racing and tyre burning party. Reading a good book [2] :) on a beach would hurt less. respects [1] https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/catastrophizing https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/catastrophizing [2] https://digitalvegan.net https://digitalvegan.net
      - ux-app 5y ago
        >Whatever you think of as a humane activity, I can find a reason why it's destroying the planet so you may as well not bother - just continue destroying the planet as you are yes that's correct, there is nothing you can personally do that will make a measurable difference to making the planet a better place. You're wasting your time. Even collective action is probably doomed. There are just too many humans on the planet. In 1500, the world population was 460million. That is probably a level that the planet can indefinitely sustain. We're at 8billion now and we're fatally addicted to fossil fuels. Buying local and taking a bus to work are not going to save the planet.
    - mattcwilson 5y ago
      > Well I'd be curious to hear how. A lot of hard work, non vehicular labor, local sourcing, and luck, providence, perseverance, and serendipity. How do you suppose humans did it prior to the invention of the coal mine and oil drill? Once again - not trying to be facetious or patronizing; just legitimately answering the request.
      - 5y ago