4 ms·

I never understood why major OS developers never saw codecs as their responsibility. Instead, the native video player for each platform supports a very limited

by cm2187 5y ago

I never understood why major OS developers never saw codecs as their responsibility. Instead, the native video player for each platform supports a very limited number of codecs, and sometimes isn’t even extendible with more codecs. You shouldn’t need a VLC. This has been the case since the beginning of the internet.

CJefferson 5y ago
In many cases it was patent issues -- putting the codecs in the OS could significantly increase it's cost. I'm at least 15 years out of date, so this may be a much less serious issue nowadays (although also codec issues seem less serious, windows will just open most formats I try).
- cm2187 5y ago
  Well, how do ffmpeg and vlc go around that problem then? Most players will not even touch an mkv file, whatever the codec.
  - soapdog 5y ago
    Because there is no money in suing either projects. If a large company such as Apple ships all these codecs, patent holders will flock to try a quick cash grab. These litigations are time and money consuming.
    - prmoustache 5y ago
      They don't sue because they can't sue. Software patents aren't valid in europe.
      - soapdog 5y ago
        They can sue in the U.S.
  - jasode 5y ago
    >, how do ffmpeg and vlc go around that problem then? The ffmpeg project does not distribute binaries with unlicensed or illegal code. E.g. if you want ffmpeg to use libdvdcss for decrypting DVDs or use libfdk-aac to encode aac/m4a without paying license royalties to Fraunhofer, the end user has to download those components and build a custom ffmpeg on their own. No legitimate website will host ffmpeg built with the "illegal/unlicensed" libraries. E.g. When the popular Zeranoe website hosted ffmpeg executables for download, it was only built with the free GNU components. The vlc project says they can include libdvdcss because they are a French company instead of American. E.g. Microsoft removes DVD playback from Windows 8 but VLC does not: https://www.zdnet.com/article/if-vlc-can-ship-a-free-dvd-player-why-cant-microsoft/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/if-vlc-can-ship-a-free-dvd-pla...
  - prmoustache 5y ago
    software patents are a USA thing only.
moron4hire 5y ago
And the codec packs you could install to extend Windows were all super sketchy.
- hansel_der 5y ago
  *are* super sketchy thats why tech ppl use vlc (or mpv nowadays)
SSLy 5y ago
GStreamer supports a lot of formats, and is probably the native multimedia framework on GNU/Linux.
jeroenhd 5y ago
You can buy certain codes from the Windows Store to play them in Windows. On some devices the manufacturer already paid for them and you can download them for free. I don't think many people will pay $0.80 for a HEVC codec just to play the video they just recorded on their phone. There used to be so many codecs out there in use that you'd probably need to raise the price of the OS by between $5 and $10 if you wanted decent codec support. You'd also be stuck paying for those codecs, or convince customers to pay the codecs on demand later, giving their "free upgrade" a price, even if it's a small price to pay. VLC and other players exist because the jurisdictions they are made in or are hosted in aren't as strict as, for example, the American patent system, which is silly enough to actually allow patents on algorithms. Microsoft could never distribute a free player with Windows in many markets without paying for those patents. If you use or resell ffmpeg to places that enforce software patents, you actually need to check if you've paid off your patent bribe or you're opening yourself to potential lawsuits.

by cm2187 5y ago

CJefferson 5y ago

In many cases it was patent issues -- putting the codecs in the OS could significantly increase it's cost. I'm at least 15 years out of date, so this may be a much less serious issue nowadays (although also codec issues seem less serious, windows will just open most formats I try).

cm2187 5y ago
Well, how do ffmpeg and vlc go around that problem then? Most players will not even touch an mkv file, whatever the codec.
- soapdog 5y ago
  Because there is no money in suing either projects. If a large company such as Apple ships all these codecs, patent holders will flock to try a quick cash grab. These litigations are time and money consuming.
  - prmoustache 5y ago
    They don't sue because they can't sue. Software patents aren't valid in europe.
    - soapdog 5y ago
      They can sue in the U.S.
- jasode 5y ago
  >, how do ffmpeg and vlc go around that problem then? The ffmpeg project does not distribute binaries with unlicensed or illegal code. E.g. if you want ffmpeg to use libdvdcss for decrypting DVDs or use libfdk-aac to encode aac/m4a without paying license royalties to Fraunhofer, the end user has to download those components and build a custom ffmpeg on their own. No legitimate website will host ffmpeg built with the "illegal/unlicensed" libraries. E.g. When the popular Zeranoe website hosted ffmpeg executables for download, it was only built with the free GNU components. The vlc project says they can include libdvdcss because they are a French company instead of American. E.g. Microsoft removes DVD playback from Windows 8 but VLC does not: https://www.zdnet.com/article/if-vlc-can-ship-a-free-dvd-player-why-cant-microsoft/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/if-vlc-can-ship-a-free-dvd-pla...
- prmoustache 5y ago
  software patents are a USA thing only.

moron4hire 5y ago

And the codec packs you could install to extend Windows were all super sketchy.

hansel_der 5y ago
*are* super sketchy thats why tech ppl use vlc (or mpv nowadays)

SSLy 5y ago

GStreamer supports a lot of formats, and is probably the native multimedia framework on GNU/Linux.

jeroenhd 5y ago

You can buy certain codes from the Windows Store to play them in Windows. On some devices the manufacturer already paid for them and you can download them for free. I don't think many people will pay $0.80 for a HEVC codec just to play the video they just recorded on their phone. There used to be so many codecs out there in use that you'd probably need to raise the price of the OS by between $5 and $10 if you wanted decent codec support. You'd also be stuck paying for those codecs, or convince customers to pay the codecs on demand later, giving their "free upgrade" a price, even if it's a small price to pay. VLC and other players exist because the jurisdictions they are made in or are hosted in aren't as strict as, for example, the American patent system, which is silly enough to actually allow patents on algorithms. Microsoft could never distribute a free player with Windows in many markets without paying for those patents. If you use or resell ffmpeg to places that enforce software patents, you actually need to check if you've paid off your patent bribe or you're opening yourself to potential lawsuits.