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I don't know. If we are including suicide by cop and suicide attempts by cop, I think this isn't reducing suicide rates and isn't reducing the trauma some cops

I don't know. If we are including suicide by cop and suicide attempts by cop, I think this isn't reducing suicide rates and isn't reducing the trauma some cops encounter (for the cops that care). I don't know how it compares to all suicides, suicide attempts, or suicides that didn't happen. If you have those numbers, be my guest. I'll still be for reducing ignorance either way, at best I might find it good parlor talk to repeat the concession about how the myth tricks people into living.

KMag 5y ago
Now, that's the beginning of a good argument! If I'm arguing that the noble lie is morally good (I didn't say as much, but I think it's fair to read my statements as moral agreement), presumably I'm arguing in favor of a teleological moral system. Does the utility of the reduced suicide outweigh the utility of the ignorance and mistrust created by the lie? I'd concede that a noble lie is difficult to justify in other moral systems. If I'm going to convince you that a noble lie is morally good, I need to both convince you that (1) a teleological moral system is superior to the alternatives and (2) that the noble lie has net positive utility. The first is very difficult to argue if we disagree, so I shouldn't even start if I can't provide good evidence that the second is true in practice. HWR_14 makes some strong arguments that the utility is a net negative. I think I've been convinced by you and HWR_14.