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> which is simply to say, black people still get profiled by cops even if they own a factory Certainly a meme I've heard a million times. I think Obama even s

> which is simply to say, black people still get profiled by cops even if they own a factory Certainly a meme I've heard a million times. I think Obama even said it while he was still president. But so what? I don't see what it's supposed to imply. You've got a black guy living in poverty working two part time jobs no benefits, obeying one abusive authoritarian after another over his whole life. Maybe that guy really does feel more solidarity with a black factory owner whose life does not resemble his in any way. But why is this? It's not because that any black people are actually more affected by "profiling" than by their class situation. It's because they're economically conservative in the "embarrassed millionaire" sense -- more likely to view the robber baron as a figure of aspirational emulation than an exploiter. These types of people (they're the majority of every race of course) aren't leftists turned off by class politics, they're just on the opposite side: they're the economic right-wing. They're quite simply on the side of the owning class, even though they're not owners. > if you run that same materialist analysis today, the evidence for class's primary, let alone a sui generis status, is the weakest it has ever been. Huh?? People's day to day lives are still regulated by wages. Children's upbringings are defined by the competition to conform to requirements of the wage-paying institutions. How can class not be primary? Black or white, the odds have to be 90%+ that the last "or else" order you obeyed was delivered under a wage-based threat.

morelisp 5y ago
> It's not because that any black people are actually more affected by "profiling" than by their class situation. It's impossible to look at racial disparities in sentencing, qualitatively or quantitatively, and think this. The research is clear: The absolute richest black people get accused and sentenced like working-class white people. Working-class black people get treated like sub-humans. > They're quite simply on the side of the owning class, even though they're not owners. The most successful revolutionary leftist movements in the modern west are those taking up racial issues, from SNCC and the Black Panthers onwards. > Black or white, the odds have to be 90%+ that the last "or else" order you obeyed was delivered under a wage-based threat. The intensity of "else" in an "or else" order matters. Worrying about "the most recent one" is pure sampling bias. That's exactly the problem; the median worst case for working-class white leftists is losing their job. For others, regularly, it's their life. I beg you, read some books by black, female, and queer leftists. They have good ideas.
- DarylZero 5y ago
  > The intensity of "else" in an "or else" order matters. Worrying about "the most recent one" is pure sampling bias. It was a figure of speech, not any kind of "sampling" at all. I don't consider you to have addressed my point. >That's exactly the problem; the median worst case for working-class white leftists is losing their job. For others, regularly, it's their life. WTF is a "median worst case"? You can certainly say: death rates for blacks are higher than whites. But the death rates in the USA are fairly low for any race; while the rates of having your entire life structured around class-imposed labor obligations are practically 100%! For every race!

morelisp 5y ago

> It's not because that any black people are actually more affected by "profiling" than by their class situation. It's impossible to look at racial disparities in sentencing, qualitatively or quantitatively, and think this. The research is clear: The absolute richest black people get accused and sentenced like working-class white people. Working-class black people get treated like sub-humans. > They're quite simply on the side of the owning class, even though they're not owners. The most successful revolutionary leftist movements in the modern west are those taking up racial issues, from SNCC and the Black Panthers onwards. > Black or white, the odds have to be 90%+ that the last "or else" order you obeyed was delivered under a wage-based threat. The intensity of "else" in an "or else" order matters. Worrying about "the most recent one" is pure sampling bias. That's exactly the problem; the median worst case for working-class white leftists is losing their job. For others, regularly, it's their life. I beg you, read some books by black, female, and queer leftists. They have good ideas.

DarylZero 5y ago
> The intensity of "else" in an "or else" order matters. Worrying about "the most recent one" is pure sampling bias. It was a figure of speech, not any kind of "sampling" at all. I don't consider you to have addressed my point. >That's exactly the problem; the median worst case for working-class white leftists is losing their job. For others, regularly, it's their life. WTF is a "median worst case"? You can certainly say: death rates for blacks are higher than whites. But the death rates in the USA are fairly low for any race; while the rates of having your entire life structured around class-imposed labor obligations are practically 100%! For every race!