4 ms·

I agree, it happens, and it's a good idea for people to at least dip their toes in the seemingly infinite free or low cost resources out there to gauge things b

by Jach 5y ago

I agree, it happens, and it's a good idea for people to at least dip their toes in the seemingly infinite free or low cost resources out there to gauge things before spending very much money. (Again ignoring that the whole premise of these ISAs is that you don't spend money except under some reasonable "win" conditions.) But lots of people don't do that. Lots of people can't, even, though with some structure some of them can learn and be as or even more competent than those who took a mostly self-taught immediate-goal route, or self-taught-with-formal-supplementation. Seeing how little pre-college programming experience matters vs. coming in with no programming knowledge is an interesting lesson of doing college. Learning programming is actually complicated, what works for you is not going to work for everyone.

JCharante 5y ago
> Seeing how little pre-college programming experience matters vs. coming in with no programming knowledge is an interesting lesson of doing college. Wait what do you mean by this? I started programming in 6th grade (after begging my dad for a month to spend $50 on a Java textbook) and so the CS portions of college was incredibly easy. When I didn't understand algorithms I just implemented them and learned by doing (and I instantly understood how they could be applied to past projects). I would show up to classes only on the midterm and final days because it was such a headstart. I mostly focused on the humanities because there's nothing the computer science department could teach me that I couldn't teach myself online.
- Jach 5y ago
  I'm saying on average such experience tends to wash out, at least among those who graduate, though I saw it in individuals by sophomore year. You have two groups, one with some level of pre-college experience, and the other without (not even a HS programming class, though those with basically just that but not any personal learning are an interesting middle ground with parallels to 9-5 employee types that treat programming as just a job). Both groups have those who find the material easy overall (though the second will likely attend lectures; but these days the first too because attendance is mandatory at many places) and both groups have those who struggle on some things and must work and as a side-effect improve their general learning-to-learn abilities. (My own experience was a mix of both depending on the class despite having a general head start where I began in 8th grade with a book and a website dream.) By the end you'll see similar distributions with respect to measures like grades or time-to-complete-assignment or job placement and success, the starting buffs wash out. Admittedly my sampling is unscientific, and I'm willing to believe pre-college experience can help avoid some of the culling that happens, and it was especially useful to me to land a mostly part time job that wasn't an internship. I also may be biased by my choice of school where most my data comes from (though talking to coworkers and interns from various other schools at my job after college contributed) because my school was a lot more hard-core in terms of course load and especially in later years project focus -- the number of required CS courses typically exceeded other schools known for good CS programs like, say, Stanford, with 5 or 6 overall courses per semester rather than a more common 3-4, unless you did it in 5 years instead of 4.

by Jach 5y ago

JCharante 5y ago

> Seeing how little pre-college programming experience matters vs. coming in with no programming knowledge is an interesting lesson of doing college. Wait what do you mean by this? I started programming in 6th grade (after begging my dad for a month to spend $50 on a Java textbook) and so the CS portions of college was incredibly easy. When I didn't understand algorithms I just implemented them and learned by doing (and I instantly understood how they could be applied to past projects). I would show up to classes only on the midterm and final days because it was such a headstart. I mostly focused on the humanities because there's nothing the computer science department could teach me that I couldn't teach myself online.

Jach 5y ago
I'm saying on average such experience tends to wash out, at least among those who graduate, though I saw it in individuals by sophomore year. You have two groups, one with some level of pre-college experience, and the other without (not even a HS programming class, though those with basically just that but not any personal learning are an interesting middle ground with parallels to 9-5 employee types that treat programming as just a job). Both groups have those who find the material easy overall (though the second will likely attend lectures; but these days the first too because attendance is mandatory at many places) and both groups have those who struggle on some things and must work and as a side-effect improve their general learning-to-learn abilities. (My own experience was a mix of both depending on the class despite having a general head start where I began in 8th grade with a book and a website dream.) By the end you'll see similar distributions with respect to measures like grades or time-to-complete-assignment or job placement and success, the starting buffs wash out. Admittedly my sampling is unscientific, and I'm willing to believe pre-college experience can help avoid some of the culling that happens, and it was especially useful to me to land a mostly part time job that wasn't an internship. I also may be biased by my choice of school where most my data comes from (though talking to coworkers and interns from various other schools at my job after college contributed) because my school was a lot more hard-core in terms of course load and especially in later years project focus -- the number of required CS courses typically exceeded other schools known for good CS programs like, say, Stanford, with 5 or 6 overall courses per semester rather than a more common 3-4, unless you did it in 5 years instead of 4.