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It's not a free market since the manufacturer determines what the stores should sell it for and the result is a middleman extracting the value between set price

It's not a free market since the manufacturer determines what the stores should sell it for and the result is a middleman extracting the value between set price and market price.

bluGill 5y ago
That is still a free market. The free market is across all competitors, so pi competes with pine64 in the market. Pi does not compete with themselves.
- cinntaile 5y ago
  If you have 5 RPi resellers and they all have to have the same price because the manufacturer tells them so is not a free market. There is no interplay between supply and demand.
  - kube-system 5y ago
    Arguing over what constitutes a "free market" is silly. It's a gradient, not a boolean. Every real-world financial market that exists has non-market forces that apply to it, even if they're just laws against fraud.
    - cinntaile 5y ago
      I don't think it's silly, but it's definitely not easy and it's not really the important part here so I don't mind ending that discussion subject.
  - bluGill 5y ago
    I stand by my statement: you need to read it a few more times until you understand it. The market is credit card sized arm based computers, not raspberry pi. If you narrow things too much then you can make anything not a market. Wal-Mart has a monopoly on apples if you narrow the market to inside their store.
    - cinntaile 5y ago
      > I stand by my statement: you need to read it a few more times until you understand it. I understood your comment just fine, I just don't agree. Either way,as I commented earlier it's not the essence here so I see no point in further debating this particular point.
kelnos 5y ago
That only bolsters my point. I see a lot of posts here decrying Adafruit's actions as being anti-market, or that these middlemen extracting value are somehow "fixing" something wrong with the market. But it's not a free market! Adafruit (etc.) are only allowed to sell at particular price points, or the RPi Foundation will stop giving them inventory to sell. You can argue that is a free market, since Adafruit and the Foundation have voluntarily entered into a mutually-beneficial contract. But then we also have to accept that Adafruit is well within their rights to impose restrictions on how the product is bought, in an effort to ensure the products get into the hands of the people they want it to, at the (lower) price point they want. All Adafruit is doing is putting up a big "we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" sign whenever an ordering bot shows up, which is completely up to them to do if they want.

It's not a free market since the manufacturer determines what the stores should sell it for and the result is a middleman extracting the value between set price and market price.

bluGill 5y ago

That is still a free market. The free market is across all competitors, so pi competes with pine64 in the market. Pi does not compete with themselves.

cinntaile 5y ago
If you have 5 RPi resellers and they all have to have the same price because the manufacturer tells them so is not a free market. There is no interplay between supply and demand.
- kube-system 5y ago
  Arguing over what constitutes a "free market" is silly. It's a gradient, not a boolean. Every real-world financial market that exists has non-market forces that apply to it, even if they're just laws against fraud.
  - cinntaile 5y ago
    I don't think it's silly, but it's definitely not easy and it's not really the important part here so I don't mind ending that discussion subject.
- bluGill 5y ago
  I stand by my statement: you need to read it a few more times until you understand it. The market is credit card sized arm based computers, not raspberry pi. If you narrow things too much then you can make anything not a market. Wal-Mart has a monopoly on apples if you narrow the market to inside their store.
  - cinntaile 5y ago
    > I stand by my statement: you need to read it a few more times until you understand it. I understood your comment just fine, I just don't agree. Either way,as I commented earlier it's not the essence here so I see no point in further debating this particular point.

kelnos 5y ago

That only bolsters my point. I see a lot of posts here decrying Adafruit's actions as being anti-market, or that these middlemen extracting value are somehow "fixing" something wrong with the market. But it's not a free market! Adafruit (etc.) are only allowed to sell at particular price points, or the RPi Foundation will stop giving them inventory to sell. You can argue that is a free market, since Adafruit and the Foundation have voluntarily entered into a mutually-beneficial contract. But then we also have to accept that Adafruit is well within their rights to impose restrictions on how the product is bought, in an effort to ensure the products get into the hands of the people they want it to, at the (lower) price point they want. All Adafruit is doing is putting up a big "we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" sign whenever an ordering bot shows up, which is completely up to them to do if they want.