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The reality is a lot narrower than you're implying, however: “We are issuing a spirit-of-the-policy allowance to allow T1 violent speech that would otherwise b

The reality is a lot narrower than you're implying, however: “We are issuing a spirit-of-the-policy allowance to allow T1 violent speech that would otherwise be removed under the hate speech policy when: (a) targeting Russian soldiers, except prisoners of war, or (b) targeting Russians where it’s clear that the context is the Russian invasion of Ukraine (eg content mentions the invasion, self-defense, etc),” ... Meta spokesman Joe Osborne previously said the company was “for the time being, making a narrow exception for praise of the Azov regiment strictly in the context of defending Ukraine, or in their role as part of the Ukraine National Guard”. Specifically the rule change that FB made to allow violent statements against Russians (but not against any other group) is an overstatement that is not factual, because it implies that violent speech toward Russians is generally tolerated on Facebook.

freedomben 5y ago
Where did that quote come from? I know that FB took some flack for their rule change and issued a second statement on it that walked things back a bit. Is your quote from that?
- NationalPark 5y ago
  From the article you linked in your comment
  - freedomben 5y ago
    Ah yes, that was from the email that they sent to moderators, not part of the (original) public statement (unless I'm misreading). But yes thank you, that's good to point out
    - tyrfing 5y ago
      The original articles were based on internal emails that Reuters obtained and published without any comment or public statement.
      - freedomben 5y ago
        Ah interesting, thank you, I was wondering why the original was impossible to find. I'm going to verify this and then I'll update my original post with this info cause IMHO that's quite relevant.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- myrmidon 5y ago
  Just out of curiosity (I'm a non-native speaker): Is there a difference between flak and flack? Are these regional variants, maybe a US/UK thing? Would you use either, depending on exact context (literal flak-cannon vs "taking flack" phrasal verb)?
  - giaour 5y ago
    "Flak" (meaning an anti-aircraft gun or shrapnel therefrom) can also be spelled "flack." The phrase "taking flack" is either a literal or metaphorical use of this meaning. A flack (never spelled without a c) is a public relations or press agent, and to flack is to promote something (or otherwise do the work of a flack).
  - freedomben 5y ago
    Oops sorry, I started a reply and got sidetracked and didn't finish! Yes sibling comment is correct, no difference other than spelling between flak and flack. Sounds like flak is more common. It's a common idiom (at least in the US), especially regarding anything remotely political, about having multiple people "target" a person who says something they disagree with. Especially common if person A does or says something and then a bunch of news outlets/pundits criticize them for it, it's said that they're "taking flak" for whatever they did. An important note, the expression itself does not make a value judgment or convey any sort of "right" or "wrong" or good/evil on either party. You can "take flak" for saying stupid stuff, and you can "take flak" for speaking the truth in the empire of lies [1]. [1] A refernce to Orwell's quote: "Truth is treason in the empire of lies"
propogandist 5y ago
the quote makes it clear that FB is enabling threats against the Russian military (and Russians in the context of war), which would naturally cause the Russian govt to classify them as a hostile actor. the Azov movement is the neo-Nazi organization, which is clear from reporting prior to 2022: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cohen-ukraine-commentary-idUSKBN1GV2TY https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cohen-ukraine-commentary-... https://jpost.com/Diaspora/US-lifts-ban-on-funding-neo-Nazi-Ukrainian-militia-441884 https://jpost.com/Diaspora/US-lifts-ban-on-funding-neo-Nazi-... https://bbc.com/news/world-europe-28329329 https://bbc.com/news/world-europe-28329329 theguardian.com/world/2018/mar/02/neo-nazi-groups-recruit-britons-to-fight-in-ukraine
- freedomben 5y ago
  I think your comment is helpful, but your username does make it more interesting :-D
- xdennis 5y ago
  Not walking meekly into the gas chamber is a hostile action according to the Russians. Russia has neo-nazis ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wagner_Group https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wagner_Group ), islamists ( Kadyrov's thugs ) and they're planning on having al-Assad's soldiers over to slaughter Ukrainians. The Azov guys are at least doing something good for once: defending people.
  - propogandist 5y ago
    >The Azov guys are at least doing something good for once It looks like Putin called them out early on in the conflict (Feb 25) so I believe their presence is doing more harm than good >Russian President Vladimir Putin calls on the Ukrainian army to overthrow the country’s leadership whom he described as “terrorists” and “a gang of drug addicts and neo-Nazis.” https://timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/putin-calls-on-ukraine-army-to-remove-neo-nazi-leadership-in-kyiv/ https://timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/putin-calls-on-ukra...
    - boardwaalk 5y ago

freedomben 5y ago

Where did that quote come from? I know that FB took some flack for their rule change and issued a second statement on it that walked things back a bit. Is your quote from that?

NationalPark 5y ago
From the article you linked in your comment
- freedomben 5y ago
  Ah yes, that was from the email that they sent to moderators, not part of the (original) public statement (unless I'm misreading). But yes thank you, that's good to point out
  - tyrfing 5y ago
    The original articles were based on internal emails that Reuters obtained and published without any comment or public statement.
    - freedomben 5y ago
      Ah interesting, thank you, I was wondering why the original was impossible to find. I'm going to verify this and then I'll update my original post with this info cause IMHO that's quite relevant.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
myrmidon 5y ago
Just out of curiosity (I'm a non-native speaker): Is there a difference between flak and flack? Are these regional variants, maybe a US/UK thing? Would you use either, depending on exact context (literal flak-cannon vs "taking flack" phrasal verb)?
- giaour 5y ago
  "Flak" (meaning an anti-aircraft gun or shrapnel therefrom) can also be spelled "flack." The phrase "taking flack" is either a literal or metaphorical use of this meaning. A flack (never spelled without a c) is a public relations or press agent, and to flack is to promote something (or otherwise do the work of a flack).
- freedomben 5y ago
  Oops sorry, I started a reply and got sidetracked and didn't finish! Yes sibling comment is correct, no difference other than spelling between flak and flack. Sounds like flak is more common. It's a common idiom (at least in the US), especially regarding anything remotely political, about having multiple people "target" a person who says something they disagree with. Especially common if person A does or says something and then a bunch of news outlets/pundits criticize them for it, it's said that they're "taking flak" for whatever they did. An important note, the expression itself does not make a value judgment or convey any sort of "right" or "wrong" or good/evil on either party. You can "take flak" for saying stupid stuff, and you can "take flak" for speaking the truth in the empire of lies [1]. [1] A refernce to Orwell's quote: "Truth is treason in the empire of lies"

propogandist 5y ago

the quote makes it clear that FB is enabling threats against the Russian military (and Russians in the context of war), which would naturally cause the Russian govt to classify them as a hostile actor. the Azov movement is the neo-Nazi organization, which is clear from reporting prior to 2022: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cohen-ukraine-commentary-idUSKBN1GV2TY https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cohen-ukraine-commentary-... https://jpost.com/Diaspora/US-lifts-ban-on-funding-neo-Nazi-Ukrainian-militia-441884 https://jpost.com/Diaspora/US-lifts-ban-on-funding-neo-Nazi-... https://bbc.com/news/world-europe-28329329 https://bbc.com/news/world-europe-28329329 theguardian.com/world/2018/mar/02/neo-nazi-groups-recruit-britons-to-fight-in-ukraine

freedomben 5y ago
I think your comment is helpful, but your username does make it more interesting :-D
xdennis 5y ago
Not walking meekly into the gas chamber is a hostile action according to the Russians. Russia has neo-nazis ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wagner_Group https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wagner_Group ), islamists ( Kadyrov's thugs ) and they're planning on having al-Assad's soldiers over to slaughter Ukrainians. The Azov guys are at least doing something good for once: defending people.
- propogandist 5y ago
  >The Azov guys are at least doing something good for once It looks like Putin called them out early on in the conflict (Feb 25) so I believe their presence is doing more harm than good >Russian President Vladimir Putin calls on the Ukrainian army to overthrow the country’s leadership whom he described as “terrorists” and “a gang of drug addicts and neo-Nazis.” https://timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/putin-calls-on-ukraine-army-to-remove-neo-nazi-leadership-in-kyiv/ https://timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/putin-calls-on-ukra...
  - boardwaalk 5y ago