6 ms·

college is delaying young people to become mature, we're producing giant babies these days, thanks to endless parenting, online gaming, social screen time, now

college is delaying young people to become mature, we're producing giant babies these days, thanks to endless parenting, online gaming, social screen time, now probably even metaverse, you name it. on the STEM subject, teens good at math are never teacher's favorites, instead they're called nerds and some are even isolated from the rest, it's quite the opposite in Asia, or even in Europe. That's the root cause we need import so many STEMs from overseas, the culture smothered STEM from K-12. K-12 is anything but success IMHO. middle school kids are more keen about their gender or identities, or how awful US was in the past, or their hair color...high school students must show how caring they're to the community or everyone must be some leader somehow while the truth is that they can barely take care of themselves without parents' caring, for academics nowadays SAT/ACT/school-ranking/etc are either racism or unfair...I will stop here. A road to hell.

BlargMcLarg 5y ago
It's not (just) college. Even if you do make it past college, hitting what older generations would consider typical markers of adulthood (having your own place, a good job, a stable relationship, a family, etc.) are all delayed and/or more difficult to achieve. Meanwhile many jobs are trying to sell themselves not through a TC that would let one hit these markers, but through football tables, pizza parties, drinks and other social outings. Not to hate on fun activities, but it sure does feel like trying to keep young adults in a perpetual student lifestyle when you keep the booze but not give them the wage to advance in life. There are plenty of young adults who want to grow up, meeting a ridiculous amount of resistance.
- WalterBright 5y ago
  When I was a teen, teenagers had after school jobs. McDonald's, stores, etc., were populated with teen workers at minimum wage. Today those jobs are held by adults, expecting to be able to raise a family on it. Teenagers rarely have jobs, their first job waits until after they graduate from college.
  - BlargMcLarg 5y ago
    Cherry on top: once they graduate, they are met with "entry-level jobs" asking for years of experience, giant requirements lists and an overall predatory environment, only to be reinforced that failure is a personal fault and not one of the system.
    - dijonman2 5y ago
      Personal responsibility is a good thing. People need to fail, this is one of the few ways to see critical feedback that fosters growth.
      - BlargMcLarg 5y ago
        Ironic considering this is the market where feedback has been gradually taken away to the point of being so vague it is effectively useless, if there is any. Because ghosting and poor one-liners are more cost-effective. Let's not cover up bad systems because a few individuals rise to the artificial challenge and bite through.
  - tcmart14 5y ago
    And adults have always occupied those jobs too. How else did you get McDonalds Breakfast 30 years ago on a Wednesday at 8 AM in October going into the office?
    - WalterBright 5y ago
      Are you sure? I don't ever remember an adult behind the counter in those days. 18 and 19 year-olds are still teens.
      - tcmart14 5y ago
        And they are also considered legally adults, are they not? I remember at 18 signing up for 5 years in the Navy. I'd say that is pretty adult. If it isn't, you should consider contacting your senator about raising the age of enlistment.
WalterBright 5y ago
I asked my high school math teacher to write me a recommendation letter for college. He politely refused, saying he could not in good conscience recommend me. I am grateful for him for letting me know, so I could ask another teacher. More than once he'd announced in class that he was grading the class on a curve, but me separately. Suffice to say we didn't get along.
- MegaButts 5y ago
  > More than once he'd announced in class that he was grading the class on a curve, but me separately. What was his public reason for doing so?
  - WalterBright 5y ago
    Let's just say the other kids complained that I was raising the curve.
    - randcraw 5y ago
      So he didn't reject you because you were a poor student, but for some other reason? Sounds like you might want to consider what you could have done differently to improve on that outcome. Regardless of whether you agree with what s/he tells you, it's a chance to gain some valuable insights into what others think about you. Apparently, I was pretty obnoxious in high school. It took me far too long to learn this. (And to learn when not to speak my opinion.) I would have been well served if I had swallowed pride and asked teachers (and peers) for some perspective on how my attitude was, frankly, self destructive.
      - s5300 5y ago
        You’re victim blaming somebody when they were a teenager with a power tripping asshole for a teacher…?
      - WalterBright 5y ago
        Oh, I know why. I was a brat.
QuarterReptile 5y ago
>college is delaying young people to become mature, we're producing giant babies these days, A good interpretation of humans generally is 'giant baby monkeys', in that we have curiosity and openness consistent with juveniles but not with most adult animals. >on the STEM subject, teens good at math are never teacher's favorites, instead they're called nerds and some are even isolated from the rest, This doesn't bear any resemblance to my experience of a not-so-special US public school in the 2000s. I'm not saying your comment is without valid points, but you are throwing the baby out with the bathwater on your attitude about childhood.
pengaru 5y ago
> college is delaying young people to become mature, we're producing giant babies these days, thanks to endless parenting, online gaming, social screen time, now probably even metaverse, you name it. It persists into the professional space, just look at how infantilizing Silicon Valley became, trying to turn the workplace into a playpen complete with propeller head hats.
- Ternari 5y ago
  My propeller hat is a dignified part of my professional attire, thank you very much.
- Chris2048 5y ago
  Can you explain how those things are "infantilizing" beyond pure bias? Instead of playing foosball and gaming online, we should be playing cards and drinking like previous generations?
georgeburdell 5y ago
I think your views on how kids view their peers who are good at math are outdated. For example, NASA gear has, fairly recently, become a fashion trend [1]. [1] https://www.reddit.com/r/NoStupidQuestions/comments/9tk0jw/why_is_clothing_with_the_nasa_logo_suddenly_so/ https://www.reddit.com/r/NoStupidQuestions/comments/9tk0jw/w...
- synergy20 5y ago
  good to know. a drop in the ocean is a good start. I will buy a few. my kids are still in k-12, nothing has really changed for them though.
- 1auralynn 5y ago
  I graduated high school in 1998, was great at math, and most teachers liked me, some loved me. MAYBE if you're talking about going to high school in the 70's or 80's, or in a more small football-centered town or something, this was accurate at some point.
thebigman433 5y ago
> middle school kids are more keen about their gender or identities, or how awful US was in the past, or their hair color Do you genuinely believe this stuff that youre typing? I know that conservative medias say this and use it as a boogeyman to get themselves into power, but do you truly believe it? Ive worked with elementary, middle, and high school kids for the last 5 years, in an area that conservatives constantly make fun of and call awful things, but none of that is even close to the reality. Kids know that gay people exist (and are okay with that), and they know that they might want to look or act differently than they wouldve been forced to in the past. Kids today are significantly more accepting of tech and STEM subjects than they were even just a few years ago. Its significantly more common and accepted to play video games, kids are interested in video and picture editing because of social media (like TikTok), and they are increasingly tech literate. None of these boogeyman topics you claim are true, but they are continually parroted by people who want to move our education system backwards. And as a side note, > high school students must show how caring they're to the community I personally think this is a great thing. We should encourage more community involvement with young people, especially things that help out disadvantaged community members and educate them about our government. Im surprised someone who parrots the original phrases from your comment would be against something like being caring in your community.
- synergy20 5y ago
  yes I believe it genuinely, as these are my three k-12 kids told me what's going on at school, and I got involved with school quite often, I can see those myself to some extent too. the middle school one actually told me she thinks at least 1/3 of her classmates are hard to tell their genders these days, and to greet a classmate the first sentence now should be: how should I address you? otherwise her classmates actually got offended if you got it wrong on the gender side. my high school kids told me they are aware of those sensitive gender subjects at middle school and they feel it's more frequent these days. Google will show you some data points, e.g. Gen Z (from 1995+) has close to 20% claiming to be LGBT+. Things changed a lot. I'm neither a liberal or conservative, I consider myself independent.
  - wolverine876 5y ago
zaptheimpaler 5y ago
Or maybe, the entire west is increasingly a gerontocracy, with the 18-64 working age group being squeezed harder in every way to support a constantly growing number of retirees, who also as a group obstruct construction and make the traditional markers of adulthood harder to achieve. To a 70 year old, everyone below 40 must look like a baby. https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/age-dependency-ratio-old?time=latest https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/age-dependency-ratio-old?...
watwut 5y ago
> teens good at math are never teacher's favorites, instead they're called nerds and some are even isolated from the rest, it's quite the opposite in Asia, or even in Europe Nah, no on is going to isolate you for being good at math. Literally, that does not happen. Isolation of kids that cant fit it does happen and some of those are good at math. But, the "being good at math" part is not what gets them isolated. It is the other stuff and behaviors, roughly in the "poor social skills" (may include "have hard time being assertive about own boundaries") that gets you isolated.

BlargMcLarg 5y ago

It's not (just) college. Even if you do make it past college, hitting what older generations would consider typical markers of adulthood (having your own place, a good job, a stable relationship, a family, etc.) are all delayed and/or more difficult to achieve. Meanwhile many jobs are trying to sell themselves not through a TC that would let one hit these markers, but through football tables, pizza parties, drinks and other social outings. Not to hate on fun activities, but it sure does feel like trying to keep young adults in a perpetual student lifestyle when you keep the booze but not give them the wage to advance in life. There are plenty of young adults who want to grow up, meeting a ridiculous amount of resistance.

WalterBright 5y ago
When I was a teen, teenagers had after school jobs. McDonald's, stores, etc., were populated with teen workers at minimum wage. Today those jobs are held by adults, expecting to be able to raise a family on it. Teenagers rarely have jobs, their first job waits until after they graduate from college.
- BlargMcLarg 5y ago
  Cherry on top: once they graduate, they are met with "entry-level jobs" asking for years of experience, giant requirements lists and an overall predatory environment, only to be reinforced that failure is a personal fault and not one of the system.
  - dijonman2 5y ago
    Personal responsibility is a good thing. People need to fail, this is one of the few ways to see critical feedback that fosters growth.
    - BlargMcLarg 5y ago
      Ironic considering this is the market where feedback has been gradually taken away to the point of being so vague it is effectively useless, if there is any. Because ghosting and poor one-liners are more cost-effective. Let's not cover up bad systems because a few individuals rise to the artificial challenge and bite through.
- tcmart14 5y ago
  And adults have always occupied those jobs too. How else did you get McDonalds Breakfast 30 years ago on a Wednesday at 8 AM in October going into the office?
  - WalterBright 5y ago
    Are you sure? I don't ever remember an adult behind the counter in those days. 18 and 19 year-olds are still teens.
    - tcmart14 5y ago
      And they are also considered legally adults, are they not? I remember at 18 signing up for 5 years in the Navy. I'd say that is pretty adult. If it isn't, you should consider contacting your senator about raising the age of enlistment.

WalterBright 5y ago

I asked my high school math teacher to write me a recommendation letter for college. He politely refused, saying he could not in good conscience recommend me. I am grateful for him for letting me know, so I could ask another teacher. More than once he'd announced in class that he was grading the class on a curve, but me separately. Suffice to say we didn't get along.

MegaButts 5y ago
> More than once he'd announced in class that he was grading the class on a curve, but me separately. What was his public reason for doing so?
- WalterBright 5y ago
  Let's just say the other kids complained that I was raising the curve.
  - randcraw 5y ago
    So he didn't reject you because you were a poor student, but for some other reason? Sounds like you might want to consider what you could have done differently to improve on that outcome. Regardless of whether you agree with what s/he tells you, it's a chance to gain some valuable insights into what others think about you. Apparently, I was pretty obnoxious in high school. It took me far too long to learn this. (And to learn when not to speak my opinion.) I would have been well served if I had swallowed pride and asked teachers (and peers) for some perspective on how my attitude was, frankly, self destructive.
    - s5300 5y ago
      You’re victim blaming somebody when they were a teenager with a power tripping asshole for a teacher…?
    - WalterBright 5y ago
      Oh, I know why. I was a brat.

QuarterReptile 5y ago

>college is delaying young people to become mature, we're producing giant babies these days, A good interpretation of humans generally is 'giant baby monkeys', in that we have curiosity and openness consistent with juveniles but not with most adult animals. >on the STEM subject, teens good at math are never teacher's favorites, instead they're called nerds and some are even isolated from the rest, This doesn't bear any resemblance to my experience of a not-so-special US public school in the 2000s. I'm not saying your comment is without valid points, but you are throwing the baby out with the bathwater on your attitude about childhood.

pengaru 5y ago

> college is delaying young people to become mature, we're producing giant babies these days, thanks to endless parenting, online gaming, social screen time, now probably even metaverse, you name it. It persists into the professional space, just look at how infantilizing Silicon Valley became, trying to turn the workplace into a playpen complete with propeller head hats.

Ternari 5y ago
My propeller hat is a dignified part of my professional attire, thank you very much.
Chris2048 5y ago
Can you explain how those things are "infantilizing" beyond pure bias? Instead of playing foosball and gaming online, we should be playing cards and drinking like previous generations?

georgeburdell 5y ago

I think your views on how kids view their peers who are good at math are outdated. For example, NASA gear has, fairly recently, become a fashion trend [1]. [1] https://www.reddit.com/r/NoStupidQuestions/comments/9tk0jw/why_is_clothing_with_the_nasa_logo_suddenly_so/ https://www.reddit.com/r/NoStupidQuestions/comments/9tk0jw/w...

synergy20 5y ago
good to know. a drop in the ocean is a good start. I will buy a few. my kids are still in k-12, nothing has really changed for them though.
1auralynn 5y ago
I graduated high school in 1998, was great at math, and most teachers liked me, some loved me. MAYBE if you're talking about going to high school in the 70's or 80's, or in a more small football-centered town or something, this was accurate at some point.

thebigman433 5y ago

> middle school kids are more keen about their gender or identities, or how awful US was in the past, or their hair color Do you genuinely believe this stuff that youre typing? I know that conservative medias say this and use it as a boogeyman to get themselves into power, but do you truly believe it? Ive worked with elementary, middle, and high school kids for the last 5 years, in an area that conservatives constantly make fun of and call awful things, but none of that is even close to the reality. Kids know that gay people exist (and are okay with that), and they know that they might want to look or act differently than they wouldve been forced to in the past. Kids today are significantly more accepting of tech and STEM subjects than they were even just a few years ago. Its significantly more common and accepted to play video games, kids are interested in video and picture editing because of social media (like TikTok), and they are increasingly tech literate. None of these boogeyman topics you claim are true, but they are continually parroted by people who want to move our education system backwards. And as a side note, > high school students must show how caring they're to the community I personally think this is a great thing. We should encourage more community involvement with young people, especially things that help out disadvantaged community members and educate them about our government. Im surprised someone who parrots the original phrases from your comment would be against something like being caring in your community.

synergy20 5y ago
yes I believe it genuinely, as these are my three k-12 kids told me what's going on at school, and I got involved with school quite often, I can see those myself to some extent too. the middle school one actually told me she thinks at least 1/3 of her classmates are hard to tell their genders these days, and to greet a classmate the first sentence now should be: how should I address you? otherwise her classmates actually got offended if you got it wrong on the gender side. my high school kids told me they are aware of those sensitive gender subjects at middle school and they feel it's more frequent these days. Google will show you some data points, e.g. Gen Z (from 1995+) has close to 20% claiming to be LGBT+. Things changed a lot. I'm neither a liberal or conservative, I consider myself independent.
- wolverine876 5y ago

zaptheimpaler 5y ago

Or maybe, the entire west is increasingly a gerontocracy, with the 18-64 working age group being squeezed harder in every way to support a constantly growing number of retirees, who also as a group obstruct construction and make the traditional markers of adulthood harder to achieve. To a 70 year old, everyone below 40 must look like a baby. https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/age-dependency-ratio-old?time=latest https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/age-dependency-ratio-old?...

watwut 5y ago

> teens good at math are never teacher's favorites, instead they're called nerds and some are even isolated from the rest, it's quite the opposite in Asia, or even in Europe Nah, no on is going to isolate you for being good at math. Literally, that does not happen. Isolation of kids that cant fit it does happen and some of those are good at math. But, the "being good at math" part is not what gets them isolated. It is the other stuff and behaviors, roughly in the "poor social skills" (may include "have hard time being assertive about own boundaries") that gets you isolated.