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Here in the US midwest beavers are shot and their dams dynamited wherever they are found. The majority of the US used to be endless chains of mosquito-infested

Here in the US midwest beavers are shot and their dams dynamited wherever they are found. The majority of the US used to be endless chains of mosquito-infested beaver ponds, the entire length of every stream and river. Nearly uninhabitable by people. The extinction of the beaver is what made the US agriculturally useful. There's not a single landowner I know, who wants a random pond flooding their field, road or house. For better or worse, the age of the beaver is definitely over. At least in the US.

meristohm 5y ago
Relevant book: Eager: the surprising secret life of beavers and why they matter, by Ben Goldfarb (2018) [0] "The arrival of Europeans warped indigenous peoples’ relationship with beaver from subsistence and kinship to extraction, turning many tribes, as Harold Hickerson put it, into “a vast forest proletariat whose production was raw fur.”12 The trade began innocuously enough in the 1500s, with European cod fishermen casually exchanging goods for pelts during their spells ashore in Newfoundland. When Henry Hudson found the Mohawk eager to trade in 1609 in modern-day New York, the rush was on. Europe was then in the process of exterminating nearly all its own beavers, and the untapped source of pelts proved irresistible." Beavers help the land retain water. Our current, predominant agricultural system in the United States requires significant energy towards irrigation and fertilization. There are other systems that I see as better, and which would include beavers. I'm a "landowner" in the current legal system, and while you likely don't really know me, I welcome a pond here, especially if the surround land also has plenty of insects, arachnids, reptiles, amphibians, and mammals (and all the others). Mosquitoes are not much of a problem around here, but I've lived places where the air is thick with them. Maintaining balanced diversity (including human population) is important to me. Some of my neighbors have beaver families on their land and appreciate what they do. Some of those neighbors also grow food for themselves and others. [0] https://www.worldcat.org/title/eager-the-surprising-secret-life-of-beavers-and-why-they-matter/oclc/1049630875 https://www.worldcat.org/title/eager-the-surprising-secret-l...
actionfromafar 5y ago
Maybe I'm missing something, but the US is so incredibly vast, I can't understand why you don't have place for a least a few beavers.
- nickff 5y ago
  According to Wikipedia, there are quite a few beavers in North America, but not as many as there used to be: >"Protections have allowed the beaver population on the continent to rebound to an estimated 6–12 million by the late 20th century; this is a fraction of the originally estimated 60–400 million North American beavers before the days of the fur trade." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaver#Distribution_and_status https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaver#Distribution_and_status
- quickthrowman 5y ago
  There are plenty of beavers in northern Minnesota, particularly in the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness along the Canadian border.
njarboe 5y ago
Beaver populations are increasing dramatically on wilderness and other public lands in the western US. They definitely change the landscape and kill a lot of trees. Good for vistas and stream health, but I don't know much about it. Sometimes I get a bit sad when I see large cottonwood trees taken down by beavers, but the meadows they create when their ponds silt up are quite beautiful.
- genericone 5y ago
  And the standing water that beavers create probably do assist in groundwater infiltration in a not insignificant way for the local flora. Otherwise that water will just runoff down the stream to some other spot where it can spread out. I am under the impression that beavers intrinsically hate the sound of running water, and some beaver brain process causes them to feel the need to dam it up.
jjtheblunt 5y ago
What? I'm from the US midwest and have never heard of that. Where?
- JoeAltmaier 5y ago
  Not sure what the question is. Do you have beaver where you live? Were they flooding fields and parks?
  - jjtheblunt 5y ago
    I'm from the Chicagoland area, i've seen a beaver or something very similar, as there are numerous huge forest preserves, and have never heard of humans bothering them. Perhaps that's because their activities are quaint in the area.
ionwake 5y ago
Not sure if this is interesting to anyone but, I grew up in Spain, in a relatively wild area near the coast, and then spent my remaining couple decades in England in different places. When I went to Atlanta and the surrounding suburbs, I was completely flabbergasted to come across a tree which had been felled by a beaver. Not because they exist, I know quite a bit about them, but perhaps specifically because there no signs, no souvenir items in the nearby park shop, no jokes, no real mention, of the fact the forests around atlanta were so diverse they had large mammals. It was just an after thought. Oh that tree? Yes a big beaver did that randomly no biggie. I then drove to the swamps in Florida and saw the alligators. But I was expecting the wildlife - as its an attraction and known about. Small things like seeing a flock of large birds on a telephone line, in the city of miami, yet a flock of such a size, with such large birds, is something I had not seen in my life in any city or place in Europe - and I doubt anyone walking passed would stop to notice it. I really do think the bio diversity in the US is taken for granted! I know about the special parks and often spoken about animals and habitats, but its the small moments you realise just dont exist anywhere else that I am unsure the locals even realise. Maybe I am wrong - just wanted to share, thanks.
- kingkawn 5y ago
  It’s because Europe has hunted to extinction nearly every large mammal on the continent that america seems shocking by comparison.
  - zeristor 5y ago
    A large part is down to the trade in beaver pelts Hudson Bay company, and the Russian expansion into Siberia was in large part down to obtaining more beaver pelts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_fur_trade https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_fur_trade Beaver pelts have been referred to as ‘soft gold’.
- pfdietz 5y ago
  It's very common for white-tailed deer to wander into ones backyard if one lives sufficiently far out in the suburbs. These animals can weigh as much as 135 kg (male) or 90 kg (female). I've had as many as five on them on my property at the same time (upstate NY). It's a function of lower population density, I think, as well as agriculture tending to have moved to the midwest and plains states. There's been a lot of regeneration of forests in the Eastern US since they were clearcut in the 19th century.
hh3k0 5y ago
For better or worse, climate change will put an end to the age of mankind. So, who knows? The age of the beaver may just see a reboot.
- gwright 5y ago
  > For better or worse, climate change will put an end to the age of mankind What are you talking about? Climate change, as predicted in the IPCC reports at least, don't even come close to describing the demise of mankind. That sort of talk is just apocalyptic fear mongering.
  - dijonman2 5y ago
    Gen X zeitgeist mongering
    - jessaustin 5y ago
      If Gen X had been worried about climate change we might have done something about it by now...
  - norcon4 5y ago
    If you're really reading what the IPCC is saying, you'd understand that western lifestyles are under threat. Within most peoples' lifetimes, the carrying capacity of earth will be cut in half, unless emissions are reduced severely. Perhaps this is not the demise of mankind, but I think most people would categorize that as a kind of apocalypse. I'd love for you to tell me how human population being halved is somehow okay.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
- goda90 5y ago
  This is actually the premise of a video game: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1062090/Timberborn/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/1062090/Timberborn/
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
reaperducer 5y ago
Most of what you wrote is about 30 years out of date. Here in the US midwest beavers are shot and their dams dynamited wherever they are found. Not whenever. Sometimes. Today, in many places, even in the Midwest, beavers are considered beneficial to restoring a habitat to a more natural state. As long as they're controlled. But the wholesale slaughter you describe is simply false. The majority of the US used to be endless chains of mosquito-infested beaver ponds, the entire length of every stream and river Also completely false. Unless you define "majority of the US" to mean "portions of the Ohio, Mississippi, and Red River watersheds," which is far from the majority of the US. The extinction of the beaver is what made the US agriculturally useful. The beaver is not extinct. For better or worse, the age of the beaver is definitely over. At least in the US. You have generalized your personal experience in your very small part of the world to be representative of a vast nation.
rossdavidh 5y ago
Well, I grew up in southern Illinois, and we had beaver in my literal backyard. Which, granted, was a wetland which flooded several months of the year, but that was mostly owing to the Army Corps of Engineers doing their job, not the beaver (they flooded where we were to prevent flooding elsewhere). So, unless this beaver eradication program is a 21st century novelty, I can say that it is not generally true of the US midwest.
RajT88 5y ago
In northern IL beavers are doing OK, as near as I can tell. I see them in office complex ponds, in addition to forest preserves and in rivers and streams. Yes, ponds in the middle of office parks. This office park, in fact: 42.046093034875774, -88.0546786192792 I have been seeing them there for years (I believe there's at least 2 distinct animals that live in those ponds).
OtomotO 5y ago
> For better or worse, the age of the beaver is definitely over. At least in the US. I wouldn't be so sure about that. After all, the age of apes may be over sooner or later and who knows, maybe beavers will take over?
verisimi 5y ago
I love wildlife; I spend lots of time in nature. But I'm not a fan of re-introducing (or introducing) these species into this habitat. Into London no less! After 400 years!! Today, everything is politicised. In the UK, farmers are forced to keep their cows enclosed in barns, in order to allow the orchids to grow. The message is 'nevermind the cows, nature is for orchids'. I strongly suspect that these sorts of measures are taken in order to justify further governmental intrusion on what people are allowed to do, and to erode property rights in the name of conservation.
- lukas099 5y ago
  > erode property rights in the name of conservation. I wish we would erode more property "rights" in the name of conservation, since th actions of landowners affect everyone else, including all future generations. Every extinct species is another burning of the Library of Alexandria.
- bigbillheck 5y ago
  > In the UK, farmers are forced to keep their cows enclosed in barns, in order to allow the orchids to grow. I was unable to find anything close to this after some searching.
kajecounterhack 5y ago
In the Pacific Northwest, beavers increase resilience to wildfire and drought. They do so by creating natural fire breaks and by increasing groundwater storage. They also do this in a way that also creates fish habitat and deeper pools that coldwater fish like trout and salmon can take advantage of to survive lower water years. They're really ecologically important, and while some may complain that they fall trees, that's actually very beneficial in the west where we have forest fires that burn far more trees than any beavers could hope to destroy to build their structures. This is not just for the northwest, but other drought and fire-prone western regions (Oregon, Colorado). TL;DR Our elimination of beavers is exacerbating the problems of drought and fire in the american west. Good video from PBS's Terra series: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lT5W32xRN4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lT5W32xRN4
- westurner 5y ago
  "Leave It to Beavers" (2018) PBS Nature [53m] https://g.co/kgs/5yA9R5 https://g.co/kgs/5yA9R5 : > A growing number of scientists, conservationists and grass-roots environmentalists have come to regard beavers as overlooked tools when it comes to reversing the disastrous effects of global warming and world-wide water shortages. Once valued for their fur or hunted as pests, these industrious rodents are seen in a new light through the eyes of this novel assembly of beaver enthusiasts and “employers” who reveal the ways in which the presence of beavers can transform and revive landscapes. Using their skills as natural builders and brilliant hydro-engineers, beavers are being recruited to accomplish everything from finding water in a bone-dry desert to recharging water tables and coaxing life back into damaged lands. Apparently beavers are attracted to the sound of running water.
lukas099 5y ago
Fortunately, the North American beaver has a conservation status of 'least concern' (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_beaver https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_beaver) They are one of the most important animals due to their roles as 'ecosystem engineers'.
rmah 5y ago
Age of the beaver is over? There are millions of beavers in the wild in the US.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
DrBazza 5y ago
In the UK it has been recently realised that ensuring that rivers, upstream, prevents downstream flooding. There's certainly a belief that beavers could help. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/aug/08/dam-it-how-beavers-save-britain-from-flooding https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/aug/08/dam-it-h... We're also animal lovers in the UK, with, I think, a bit of a sense of guilt for the animals we've made extinct on our island. We had bears, beavers, wolves and so on - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_extinct_animals_of_the_British_Isles https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_extinct_animals_of_the... Speaking of bears, there is even a surviving bear pit about 10 miles outside London on the Thames: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosherville_Gardens https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosherville_Gardens
Angostura 5y ago
Whereas in the UK part of the attraction of beavers is as part of the amelioration of climate change and the flash flooding it can produce. a few additional swampy areas and floodplains upstream can reduce disasters downstream

meristohm 5y ago

Relevant book: Eager: the surprising secret life of beavers and why they matter, by Ben Goldfarb (2018) [0] "The arrival of Europeans warped indigenous peoples’ relationship with beaver from subsistence and kinship to extraction, turning many tribes, as Harold Hickerson put it, into “a vast forest proletariat whose production was raw fur.”12 The trade began innocuously enough in the 1500s, with European cod fishermen casually exchanging goods for pelts during their spells ashore in Newfoundland. When Henry Hudson found the Mohawk eager to trade in 1609 in modern-day New York, the rush was on. Europe was then in the process of exterminating nearly all its own beavers, and the untapped source of pelts proved irresistible." Beavers help the land retain water. Our current, predominant agricultural system in the United States requires significant energy towards irrigation and fertilization. There are other systems that I see as better, and which would include beavers. I'm a "landowner" in the current legal system, and while you likely don't really know me, I welcome a pond here, especially if the surround land also has plenty of insects, arachnids, reptiles, amphibians, and mammals (and all the others). Mosquitoes are not much of a problem around here, but I've lived places where the air is thick with them. Maintaining balanced diversity (including human population) is important to me. Some of my neighbors have beaver families on their land and appreciate what they do. Some of those neighbors also grow food for themselves and others. [0] https://www.worldcat.org/title/eager-the-surprising-secret-life-of-beavers-and-why-they-matter/oclc/1049630875 https://www.worldcat.org/title/eager-the-surprising-secret-l...

actionfromafar 5y ago

Maybe I'm missing something, but the US is so incredibly vast, I can't understand why you don't have place for a least a few beavers.

nickff 5y ago
According to Wikipedia, there are quite a few beavers in North America, but not as many as there used to be: >"Protections have allowed the beaver population on the continent to rebound to an estimated 6–12 million by the late 20th century; this is a fraction of the originally estimated 60–400 million North American beavers before the days of the fur trade." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaver#Distribution_and_status https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaver#Distribution_and_status
quickthrowman 5y ago
There are plenty of beavers in northern Minnesota, particularly in the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness along the Canadian border.

njarboe 5y ago

Beaver populations are increasing dramatically on wilderness and other public lands in the western US. They definitely change the landscape and kill a lot of trees. Good for vistas and stream health, but I don't know much about it. Sometimes I get a bit sad when I see large cottonwood trees taken down by beavers, but the meadows they create when their ponds silt up are quite beautiful.

genericone 5y ago
And the standing water that beavers create probably do assist in groundwater infiltration in a not insignificant way for the local flora. Otherwise that water will just runoff down the stream to some other spot where it can spread out. I am under the impression that beavers intrinsically hate the sound of running water, and some beaver brain process causes them to feel the need to dam it up.

jjtheblunt 5y ago

What? I'm from the US midwest and have never heard of that. Where?

JoeAltmaier 5y ago
Not sure what the question is. Do you have beaver where you live? Were they flooding fields and parks?
- jjtheblunt 5y ago
  I'm from the Chicagoland area, i've seen a beaver or something very similar, as there are numerous huge forest preserves, and have never heard of humans bothering them. Perhaps that's because their activities are quaint in the area.

ionwake 5y ago

Not sure if this is interesting to anyone but, I grew up in Spain, in a relatively wild area near the coast, and then spent my remaining couple decades in England in different places. When I went to Atlanta and the surrounding suburbs, I was completely flabbergasted to come across a tree which had been felled by a beaver. Not because they exist, I know quite a bit about them, but perhaps specifically because there no signs, no souvenir items in the nearby park shop, no jokes, no real mention, of the fact the forests around atlanta were so diverse they had large mammals. It was just an after thought. Oh that tree? Yes a big beaver did that randomly no biggie. I then drove to the swamps in Florida and saw the alligators. But I was expecting the wildlife - as its an attraction and known about. Small things like seeing a flock of large birds on a telephone line, in the city of miami, yet a flock of such a size, with such large birds, is something I had not seen in my life in any city or place in Europe - and I doubt anyone walking passed would stop to notice it. I really do think the bio diversity in the US is taken for granted! I know about the special parks and often spoken about animals and habitats, but its the small moments you realise just dont exist anywhere else that I am unsure the locals even realise. Maybe I am wrong - just wanted to share, thanks.

kingkawn 5y ago
It’s because Europe has hunted to extinction nearly every large mammal on the continent that america seems shocking by comparison.
- zeristor 5y ago
  A large part is down to the trade in beaver pelts Hudson Bay company, and the Russian expansion into Siberia was in large part down to obtaining more beaver pelts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_fur_trade https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_fur_trade Beaver pelts have been referred to as ‘soft gold’.
pfdietz 5y ago
It's very common for white-tailed deer to wander into ones backyard if one lives sufficiently far out in the suburbs. These animals can weigh as much as 135 kg (male) or 90 kg (female). I've had as many as five on them on my property at the same time (upstate NY). It's a function of lower population density, I think, as well as agriculture tending to have moved to the midwest and plains states. There's been a lot of regeneration of forests in the Eastern US since they were clearcut in the 19th century.

hh3k0 5y ago

For better or worse, climate change will put an end to the age of mankind. So, who knows? The age of the beaver may just see a reboot.

gwright 5y ago
> For better or worse, climate change will put an end to the age of mankind What are you talking about? Climate change, as predicted in the IPCC reports at least, don't even come close to describing the demise of mankind. That sort of talk is just apocalyptic fear mongering.
- dijonman2 5y ago
  Gen X zeitgeist mongering
  - jessaustin 5y ago
    If Gen X had been worried about climate change we might have done something about it by now...
- norcon4 5y ago
  If you're really reading what the IPCC is saying, you'd understand that western lifestyles are under threat. Within most peoples' lifetimes, the carrying capacity of earth will be cut in half, unless emissions are reduced severely. Perhaps this is not the demise of mankind, but I think most people would categorize that as a kind of apocalypse. I'd love for you to tell me how human population being halved is somehow okay.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
goda90 5y ago
This is actually the premise of a video game: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1062090/Timberborn/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/1062090/Timberborn/

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

reaperducer 5y ago

Most of what you wrote is about 30 years out of date. Here in the US midwest beavers are shot and their dams dynamited wherever they are found. Not whenever. Sometimes. Today, in many places, even in the Midwest, beavers are considered beneficial to restoring a habitat to a more natural state. As long as they're controlled. But the wholesale slaughter you describe is simply false. The majority of the US used to be endless chains of mosquito-infested beaver ponds, the entire length of every stream and river Also completely false. Unless you define "majority of the US" to mean "portions of the Ohio, Mississippi, and Red River watersheds," which is far from the majority of the US. The extinction of the beaver is what made the US agriculturally useful. The beaver is not extinct. For better or worse, the age of the beaver is definitely over. At least in the US. You have generalized your personal experience in your very small part of the world to be representative of a vast nation.

rossdavidh 5y ago

Well, I grew up in southern Illinois, and we had beaver in my literal backyard. Which, granted, was a wetland which flooded several months of the year, but that was mostly owing to the Army Corps of Engineers doing their job, not the beaver (they flooded where we were to prevent flooding elsewhere). So, unless this beaver eradication program is a 21st century novelty, I can say that it is not generally true of the US midwest.

RajT88 5y ago

In northern IL beavers are doing OK, as near as I can tell. I see them in office complex ponds, in addition to forest preserves and in rivers and streams. Yes, ponds in the middle of office parks. This office park, in fact: 42.046093034875774, -88.0546786192792 I have been seeing them there for years (I believe there's at least 2 distinct animals that live in those ponds).

OtomotO 5y ago

> For better or worse, the age of the beaver is definitely over. At least in the US. I wouldn't be so sure about that. After all, the age of apes may be over sooner or later and who knows, maybe beavers will take over?

verisimi 5y ago

I love wildlife; I spend lots of time in nature. But I'm not a fan of re-introducing (or introducing) these species into this habitat. Into London no less! After 400 years!! Today, everything is politicised. In the UK, farmers are forced to keep their cows enclosed in barns, in order to allow the orchids to grow. The message is 'nevermind the cows, nature is for orchids'. I strongly suspect that these sorts of measures are taken in order to justify further governmental intrusion on what people are allowed to do, and to erode property rights in the name of conservation.

lukas099 5y ago
> erode property rights in the name of conservation. I wish we would erode more property "rights" in the name of conservation, since th actions of landowners affect everyone else, including all future generations. Every extinct species is another burning of the Library of Alexandria.
bigbillheck 5y ago
> In the UK, farmers are forced to keep their cows enclosed in barns, in order to allow the orchids to grow. I was unable to find anything close to this after some searching.

kajecounterhack 5y ago

In the Pacific Northwest, beavers increase resilience to wildfire and drought. They do so by creating natural fire breaks and by increasing groundwater storage. They also do this in a way that also creates fish habitat and deeper pools that coldwater fish like trout and salmon can take advantage of to survive lower water years. They're really ecologically important, and while some may complain that they fall trees, that's actually very beneficial in the west where we have forest fires that burn far more trees than any beavers could hope to destroy to build their structures. This is not just for the northwest, but other drought and fire-prone western regions (Oregon, Colorado). TL;DR Our elimination of beavers is exacerbating the problems of drought and fire in the american west. Good video from PBS's Terra series: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lT5W32xRN4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lT5W32xRN4

westurner 5y ago
"Leave It to Beavers" (2018) PBS Nature [53m] https://g.co/kgs/5yA9R5 https://g.co/kgs/5yA9R5 : > A growing number of scientists, conservationists and grass-roots environmentalists have come to regard beavers as overlooked tools when it comes to reversing the disastrous effects of global warming and world-wide water shortages. Once valued for their fur or hunted as pests, these industrious rodents are seen in a new light through the eyes of this novel assembly of beaver enthusiasts and “employers” who reveal the ways in which the presence of beavers can transform and revive landscapes. Using their skills as natural builders and brilliant hydro-engineers, beavers are being recruited to accomplish everything from finding water in a bone-dry desert to recharging water tables and coaxing life back into damaged lands. Apparently beavers are attracted to the sound of running water.

lukas099 5y ago

Fortunately, the North American beaver has a conservation status of 'least concern' (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_beaver https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_beaver) They are one of the most important animals due to their roles as 'ecosystem engineers'.

rmah 5y ago

Age of the beaver is over? There are millions of beavers in the wild in the US.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

DrBazza 5y ago

In the UK it has been recently realised that ensuring that rivers, upstream, prevents downstream flooding. There's certainly a belief that beavers could help. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/aug/08/dam-it-how-beavers-save-britain-from-flooding https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/aug/08/dam-it-h... We're also animal lovers in the UK, with, I think, a bit of a sense of guilt for the animals we've made extinct on our island. We had bears, beavers, wolves and so on - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_extinct_animals_of_the_British_Isles https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_extinct_animals_of_the... Speaking of bears, there is even a surviving bear pit about 10 miles outside London on the Thames: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosherville_Gardens https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosherville_Gardens

Angostura 5y ago

Whereas in the UK part of the attraction of beavers is as part of the amelioration of climate change and the flash flooding it can produce. a few additional swampy areas and floodplains upstream can reduce disasters downstream