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So is an H.264/H.265 video clip at 5 or even 10 mbit/s on my 4 years old iPhone, at about 2 watts of power consumption instead of 35 watts. Can you see the adva

So is an H.264/H.265 video clip at 5 or even 10 mbit/s on my 4 years old iPhone, at about 2 watts of power consumption instead of 35 watts. Can you see the advantage? I like open and free standards, and I dislike royalties, but the political aspect is best foregone when one of the alternatives really is objectively so much better for everyone.

clouddrover 5y ago
One of the alternatives is clearly not objectively so much better for everyone. If they were so much better then VP9 and AV1 wouldn't exist. Here's what video streamers say: https://youtube-eng.googleblog.com/2015/04/vp9-faster-better-buffer-free-youtube.html https://youtube-eng.googleblog.com/2015/04/vp9-faster-better... https://engineering.fb.com/2018/04/10/video-engineering/av1-beats-x264-and-libvpx-vp9-in-practical-use-case/ https://engineering.fb.com/2018/04/10/video-engineering/av1-... https://netflixtechblog.com/netflix-now-streaming-av1-on-android-d5264a515202 https://netflixtechblog.com/netflix-now-streaming-av1-on-and... https://medium.com/netflix-techblog/bringing-av1-streaming-to-netflix-members-tvs-b7fc88e42320 https://medium.com/netflix-techblog/bringing-av1-streaming-t... https://bitmovin.com/bitmovin-improves-av1-video-encoding/ https://bitmovin.com/bitmovin-improves-av1-video-encoding/ https://blog.webex.com/video-conferencing/cisco-leap-frogs-h-264-video-collaboration-with-real-time-av1-codec/ https://blog.webex.com/video-conferencing/cisco-leap-frogs-h... https://blog.webex.com/engineering/the-av1-video-codec-comes-to-webex/ https://blog.webex.com/engineering/the-av1-video-codec-comes... Your problem is fundamentally an emotional one. Now that you suspect Device X will perform poorly at Task Y you feel buyer's remorse. Try not to worry about it so much. Computer hardware will continue to be made obsolete by more demanding software for quite some time yet.
- daneel_w 5y ago
  There are no emotions involved here, with the exception of your childish choice to try misconstrue my argument. I consider the MPEG family as objectively better on the technical merit of GPU/VPU hardware decoding being available everywhere - it's fast and it's energy efficient.
  - themerone 5y ago
    This is not true. AV1 is at least as widely supported as VVC. Nothing supports hardware decoding if mpeg EVC, and hardware decoding if the original mpeg 4 (xvid generation) was never a big deal.
  - clouddrover 5y ago
    > There are no emotions involved here Of course there are. This is typical. > I consider the MPEG family as objectively better on the technical merit of GPU/VPU hardware decoding being available everywhere Then there will never be any codec development. It's a silly position to take.
    - daneel_w 5y ago
      You're very stubborn with telling me what my position and my own arguments are. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and presume you're not just looking for people to rile up, but rather have the bad habit of leaping ahead and making other people's arguments and stances up on your own to better fit your desired counterpoint, so I'll clarify: I am certainly not against new development or progress, and I don't think that it's pointless to put an effort into AV1 or VP9. As I wrote elsewhere in this discussion, I just don't see this taking off until there's hardware decoding available, which I fully expect there to be. I'm merely underlining that the MPEG family is the state of the art.
      - clouddrover 5y ago
        > I just don't see this taking off until there's hardware decoding available Hardware decoding is available. And dav1d is a very fast software decoder. I don't have AV1 hardware and yet I play back AV1 on YouTube just fine via dav1d. > I'm merely underlining that the MPEG family is the state of the art. It isn't.

clouddrover 5y ago

One of the alternatives is clearly not objectively so much better for everyone. If they were so much better then VP9 and AV1 wouldn't exist. Here's what video streamers say: https://youtube-eng.googleblog.com/2015/04/vp9-faster-better-buffer-free-youtube.html https://youtube-eng.googleblog.com/2015/04/vp9-faster-better... https://engineering.fb.com/2018/04/10/video-engineering/av1-beats-x264-and-libvpx-vp9-in-practical-use-case/ https://engineering.fb.com/2018/04/10/video-engineering/av1-... https://netflixtechblog.com/netflix-now-streaming-av1-on-android-d5264a515202 https://netflixtechblog.com/netflix-now-streaming-av1-on-and... https://medium.com/netflix-techblog/bringing-av1-streaming-to-netflix-members-tvs-b7fc88e42320 https://medium.com/netflix-techblog/bringing-av1-streaming-t... https://bitmovin.com/bitmovin-improves-av1-video-encoding/ https://bitmovin.com/bitmovin-improves-av1-video-encoding/ https://blog.webex.com/video-conferencing/cisco-leap-frogs-h-264-video-collaboration-with-real-time-av1-codec/ https://blog.webex.com/video-conferencing/cisco-leap-frogs-h... https://blog.webex.com/engineering/the-av1-video-codec-comes-to-webex/ https://blog.webex.com/engineering/the-av1-video-codec-comes... Your problem is fundamentally an emotional one. Now that you suspect Device X will perform poorly at Task Y you feel buyer's remorse. Try not to worry about it so much. Computer hardware will continue to be made obsolete by more demanding software for quite some time yet.

daneel_w 5y ago
There are no emotions involved here, with the exception of your childish choice to try misconstrue my argument. I consider the MPEG family as objectively better on the technical merit of GPU/VPU hardware decoding being available everywhere - it's fast and it's energy efficient.
- themerone 5y ago
  This is not true. AV1 is at least as widely supported as VVC. Nothing supports hardware decoding if mpeg EVC, and hardware decoding if the original mpeg 4 (xvid generation) was never a big deal.
- clouddrover 5y ago
  > There are no emotions involved here Of course there are. This is typical. > I consider the MPEG family as objectively better on the technical merit of GPU/VPU hardware decoding being available everywhere Then there will never be any codec development. It's a silly position to take.
  - daneel_w 5y ago
    You're very stubborn with telling me what my position and my own arguments are. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and presume you're not just looking for people to rile up, but rather have the bad habit of leaping ahead and making other people's arguments and stances up on your own to better fit your desired counterpoint, so I'll clarify: I am certainly not against new development or progress, and I don't think that it's pointless to put an effort into AV1 or VP9. As I wrote elsewhere in this discussion, I just don't see this taking off until there's hardware decoding available, which I fully expect there to be. I'm merely underlining that the MPEG family is the state of the art.
    - clouddrover 5y ago
      > I just don't see this taking off until there's hardware decoding available Hardware decoding is available. And dav1d is a very fast software decoder. I don't have AV1 hardware and yet I play back AV1 on YouTube just fine via dav1d. > I'm merely underlining that the MPEG family is the state of the art. It isn't.