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Yeah but I’m not talking about sanctions I’m talking about writing malware. Nukes are the worst tool yet, even worse than malware. This isn’t an equivalence gam

Yeah but I’m not talking about sanctions I’m talking about writing malware. Nukes are the worst tool yet, even worse than malware. This isn’t an equivalence game, and I don’t think sanctions have anything to do with writing malware.

rosndo 5y ago
So you also think that sanctions against Russia are evil? If not, what’s the big difference that makes Russia-targeted malware more evil than the vastly more destructive economic sanctions?
- randomhodler84 5y ago
  You want to find equivalence. And you want others to agree with you with equivalence. I won’t provide that because it’s bullshit. I am talking about jerks writing malware and hurting systems and you keep talking about sanctions. Buddy. You are obsessed with sanctions. Is it to do with your wife’s fathers billions?
  - rosndo 5y ago
    I’m absolutely in favor of sanctions, as I am also in favor of this kind of “protestware”. To me the equivalence is obvious, malware is just another kind of economic sanction. >I won’t provide that because it’s bullshit Why is it bullshit? What’s the moral difference? The only difference I see is that sanctions are imposed by governments, but are the governments not also jerks if ”protestware” developers are? If not, why not? What about western companies pulling out of Russia without being legally required to do so? Are they jerks too? They sure are causing much more harm than these protestware developers. > Buddy. You are obsessed with sanctions. Is it to do with your wife’s fathers billions? It has to do with many of my friends who are currently stuck in Ukraine, in the middle of a war of aggression initiated by Russia. Today my Kiev based PT called me in tears, asking if I can do anything to help his wife and children flee the country. He’s unable to leave the country himself due to the current rules. I get such calls every day. I’m certainly biased, but probably not in the way you think. We’ll remain unimaginably rich regardless of any sanctions, not being able to land our jets in London is hardly anything to cry about, plenty of charters available.
    - randomhodler84 5y ago
      Thank you for sharing that. It is a very scary time and it must be crushing to worry about friends in a war zone. I appreciate the context. I hope you are able to find a solution to help those folks out.
    - randomhodler84 5y ago
      I overstepped that and that was stalky. I do sincerely wish good things on you and your close ones, and we are all super on edge. It’s super hard times right now near what what supposed to be the sunshine after hibernation (isolation). I understand your emotional position with what we shall call equivalence, and while I cannot agree due to my own technoethical models, I can totally understand the want to see harm come to those that are causing so much pain to people you love and care about. The malicious Putin regime has caused so much suffering on the world and we all hope this will end here.
      - rosndo 5y ago
        My main goal in this conversation wasn’t to advocate harming anybody. I’m genuinely curious why software should be special. It’s weird! OTOH I see this same pattern repeated over and over again in different communities. If you go to gaming forums, you will see people generally supportive of sanctions arguing that preventing Russians from paying for videogames is a borderline crime against humanity. They’ll say it’s unacceptable to bring politics into their little club. If you go to football forums, you’ll see Chelsea fans generally supportive of sanctions arguing that sanctioning Abramovich was a step too far (because it screws over their favourite team) On HN you’ll see people passionately arguing against ISPs pulling out of Russia (they can hardly get paid), or malware in what essentially amounts to business software (lets face it, regular people aren’t going to have their home computers wiped by the node-ipc silliness). Many people seem to be happy to support these things until it eventually hits too close to their own interests, then you begin to see all sort of mental gymnastics to justify how it should be different.

rosndo 5y ago

So you also think that sanctions against Russia are evil? If not, what’s the big difference that makes Russia-targeted malware more evil than the vastly more destructive economic sanctions?

randomhodler84 5y ago
You want to find equivalence. And you want others to agree with you with equivalence. I won’t provide that because it’s bullshit. I am talking about jerks writing malware and hurting systems and you keep talking about sanctions. Buddy. You are obsessed with sanctions. Is it to do with your wife’s fathers billions?
- rosndo 5y ago
  I’m absolutely in favor of sanctions, as I am also in favor of this kind of “protestware”. To me the equivalence is obvious, malware is just another kind of economic sanction. >I won’t provide that because it’s bullshit Why is it bullshit? What’s the moral difference? The only difference I see is that sanctions are imposed by governments, but are the governments not also jerks if ”protestware” developers are? If not, why not? What about western companies pulling out of Russia without being legally required to do so? Are they jerks too? They sure are causing much more harm than these protestware developers. > Buddy. You are obsessed with sanctions. Is it to do with your wife’s fathers billions? It has to do with many of my friends who are currently stuck in Ukraine, in the middle of a war of aggression initiated by Russia. Today my Kiev based PT called me in tears, asking if I can do anything to help his wife and children flee the country. He’s unable to leave the country himself due to the current rules. I get such calls every day. I’m certainly biased, but probably not in the way you think. We’ll remain unimaginably rich regardless of any sanctions, not being able to land our jets in London is hardly anything to cry about, plenty of charters available.
  - randomhodler84 5y ago
    Thank you for sharing that. It is a very scary time and it must be crushing to worry about friends in a war zone. I appreciate the context. I hope you are able to find a solution to help those folks out.
  - randomhodler84 5y ago
    I overstepped that and that was stalky. I do sincerely wish good things on you and your close ones, and we are all super on edge. It’s super hard times right now near what what supposed to be the sunshine after hibernation (isolation). I understand your emotional position with what we shall call equivalence, and while I cannot agree due to my own technoethical models, I can totally understand the want to see harm come to those that are causing so much pain to people you love and care about. The malicious Putin regime has caused so much suffering on the world and we all hope this will end here.
    - rosndo 5y ago
      My main goal in this conversation wasn’t to advocate harming anybody. I’m genuinely curious why software should be special. It’s weird! OTOH I see this same pattern repeated over and over again in different communities. If you go to gaming forums, you will see people generally supportive of sanctions arguing that preventing Russians from paying for videogames is a borderline crime against humanity. They’ll say it’s unacceptable to bring politics into their little club. If you go to football forums, you’ll see Chelsea fans generally supportive of sanctions arguing that sanctioning Abramovich was a step too far (because it screws over their favourite team) On HN you’ll see people passionately arguing against ISPs pulling out of Russia (they can hardly get paid), or malware in what essentially amounts to business software (lets face it, regular people aren’t going to have their home computers wiped by the node-ipc silliness). Many people seem to be happy to support these things until it eventually hits too close to their own interests, then you begin to see all sort of mental gymnastics to justify how it should be different.