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Last I looked, yes. AFAIK, MacOS lacks the necessary underlying features in the kernel to implement containers (at least this kind of container) at all, so you

Last I looked, yes. AFAIK, MacOS lacks the necessary underlying features in the kernel to implement containers (at least this kind of container) at all, so you have to run a Linux VM under the hood to enable rough feature parity, which is a waste of resources in my view. Yet another reason I'm planning to ditch MacOS for Linux full time very soon.

bonzini 5y ago
It's not that it doesn't implement containers, it's that most likely your container has Linux binaries in it and thus it cannot run on macOS.
happymellon 5y ago
Oh, sorry you misunderstood my question. I know that I would have to run Linux in a VM. My question was whether Podman provided an installer that set up a Linux VM in the same way that Docker Desktop does. It's completely awful, seeing Mac and Windows spend their their trying to VM Linux, poorly. But that's what I have to work with.
- smackeyacky 5y ago
  What is completely awful is developers tying themselves in knots trying to get MacOS to do things that Apple don't really want to do. The community edition of Docker is much closer to most cloud container setups anyway, so using Docker Desktop is really counter productive. There are better alternatives for your workstation, especially if your production environment is Linux based. Most, if not all, of the major development environments run well in Linux. Obviously not XCode, but for server side stuff it doesn't matter.
  - happymellon 5y ago
    You have made two assumptions there. 1. That I don't use Linux when I can. I use Fedora on all my personal equipment, including laptops. When I have a choice I do use Linux because it is simply a better development environment. The question was because this is an article about Docker Desktop on MacOS and the poster suggested using Podman. 2. That running `brew install docker` was actually that hard. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely dislike running MacOS on my work laptop, but I don't have a choice and I have not seen a job where I would have a choice. Docker works "seamlessly", except that being a VM it does use 3Gb for even the most basic containers.
    - smackeyacky 5y ago
      Most employers would give you some choice over your work machine don't they?
      - happymellon 5y ago
        No. Most employers I've encountered pick one for you. The best I've had is the choice of Windows or Mac. They have never let me pick Linux. [Edit] Actually, one did. That was also the first place that I used Linux containers, long before Docker Desktop was a thing, and before the hype train really got rolling. Back when Docker really made sense for process isolation, rather than using it as a lazy Linux VM for building on your laptop.
        smackeyacky 5y ago
        So, at the moment, if you are expected to do docker builds targetting linux servers, the clear logical choice is windows and wsl2 if you can't have a linux desktop, right?
        happymellon 5y ago
        Current work location gives developers Mac's. Something about the data scientists preferring Python which works significantly better on Mac's than Windows. I would disagree that WSL2 is a clear choice. That would mean using Windows, which is a trainwreck of a UI, and gets less consistent with each release. Has Windows 11 fixed multi-desktops yet? I personally find using Linux, with Gnome, so much more pleasant than either Windows or Mac. Much more consistent and without the arbitrary restrictions.

bonzini 5y ago

It's not that it doesn't implement containers, it's that most likely your container has Linux binaries in it and thus it cannot run on macOS.

happymellon 5y ago

Oh, sorry you misunderstood my question. I know that I would have to run Linux in a VM. My question was whether Podman provided an installer that set up a Linux VM in the same way that Docker Desktop does. It's completely awful, seeing Mac and Windows spend their their trying to VM Linux, poorly. But that's what I have to work with.

smackeyacky 5y ago
What is completely awful is developers tying themselves in knots trying to get MacOS to do things that Apple don't really want to do. The community edition of Docker is much closer to most cloud container setups anyway, so using Docker Desktop is really counter productive. There are better alternatives for your workstation, especially if your production environment is Linux based. Most, if not all, of the major development environments run well in Linux. Obviously not XCode, but for server side stuff it doesn't matter.
- happymellon 5y ago
  You have made two assumptions there. 1. That I don't use Linux when I can. I use Fedora on all my personal equipment, including laptops. When I have a choice I do use Linux because it is simply a better development environment. The question was because this is an article about Docker Desktop on MacOS and the poster suggested using Podman. 2. That running `brew install docker` was actually that hard. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely dislike running MacOS on my work laptop, but I don't have a choice and I have not seen a job where I would have a choice. Docker works "seamlessly", except that being a VM it does use 3Gb for even the most basic containers.
  - smackeyacky 5y ago
    Most employers would give you some choice over your work machine don't they?
    - happymellon 5y ago
      No. Most employers I've encountered pick one for you. The best I've had is the choice of Windows or Mac. They have never let me pick Linux. [Edit] Actually, one did. That was also the first place that I used Linux containers, long before Docker Desktop was a thing, and before the hype train really got rolling. Back when Docker really made sense for process isolation, rather than using it as a lazy Linux VM for building on your laptop.
      - smackeyacky 5y ago
        So, at the moment, if you are expected to do docker builds targetting linux servers, the clear logical choice is windows and wsl2 if you can't have a linux desktop, right?
        happymellon 5y ago
        Current work location gives developers Mac's. Something about the data scientists preferring Python which works significantly better on Mac's than Windows. I would disagree that WSL2 is a clear choice. That would mean using Windows, which is a trainwreck of a UI, and gets less consistent with each release. Has Windows 11 fixed multi-desktops yet? I personally find using Linux, with Gnome, so much more pleasant than either Windows or Mac. Much more consistent and without the arbitrary restrictions.