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How many miles are you putting on that i10?! An oil change is every 2 years or 15k km. I think it’s a bad example btw, it’s a famously reliable car (the taxi of

How many miles are you putting on that i10?! An oil change is every 2 years or 15k km. I think it’s a bad example btw, it’s a famously reliable car (the taxi of choice in Bogota fwiw)

bluedino 5y ago
Many Americans drive 15k (9,000 miles) in 6 months
Ekaros 5y ago
Even in Finland it is one oil change a year, and that includes proper winters... The price difference buys lot of maintenance. And gas...
- Retric 5y ago
  The i10 is a rather low end car, but the upgrade could be worth it. Finland gas prices are 8.464 USD/gallon right now. That’s unusually high but assuming 200k miles at say 35 mpg that adds up to 48,000 USD in gas over the lifetime of the vehicle. Not that electricity is free or that we have long term cost data, but I suspect the EV / plug in hybrid premium is a very easy choice in Finland.
  - oblio 5y ago
    I was curious so I did some math about this. The average car life in Finland seems to be 15.6 years (let's round that to 16, helping the case for EVs). The average distance traveled by Finnish cars, based on 2018 data, is about 13600km per year (let's make that 14000km per year, also helping the case for EVs). That works out to 224k km over the lifetime of a car. That's only 140k miles. Regarding your 35mpg (was 30mpg before the edit), that's 6.7l per 100km (7.8 before edit), let's make that 7l per 100km (and 8 before edit), further helping the case for EVs. But in reality a small car such as the i10 probably uses more like 5-5.5l per 100km (40-45mpg). Then the gas price is super high due to the Covid economic bounceback coupled with the supply chain issues plus the latest conflict. I'd say your numbers are too optimistic plus they're for the entire lifetime of the car. The average owner probably has the car for half that duration, at best. So they don't really care about the entire lifetime. Still, things seem to be getting closer than 10 years ago, for example. The really bad thing is the upfront price. There's no comparable EV in the i10 price range, which is a very cheap car (we're talking about a car around €12k).
    - Retric 5y ago
      I actually looked it up. 35 MPG is perhaps generous when their 2021 cars are averaging 30.9MPG, but it’s a low sample size. https://www.fuelly.com/car/hyundai/grand_i10 https://www.fuelly.com/car/hyundai/grand_i10 Finland imports a lot of used cars but: “An average car in the fleet 12.6 years of age” that suggest the car actually lasts to ~25.2 years. It’s not that simple because again they are importing and exporting used cars. https://www.aut.fi/files/2524/Annual_statistics_of_car_market_Finland_0301_2022.pdf https://www.aut.fi/files/2524/Annual_statistics_of_car_marke...
    - namdnay 5y ago
      > There's no comparable EV in the i10 price range there is now! I'm seeing the Dacia Spring appear everywhere - probably because it starts at only 13k in France including the ecobonus (I think base price is 16-17k). This is an absolute game-changer
      - oblio 5y ago
        I'm curious about it, but let's see how far the uptake goes. Where are you located?
        CRConrad 5y ago
        > Where are you located? Given the GP's >> it starts at only 13k in France including the ecobonus (I think base price is 16-17k). I'd guess France.
pja 5y ago
For some reason people in the US are obsessed with changing the oil in their vehicle. Modern engines & oils don't need the oil changing every 3000 miles, but the folklore belief in the necessity of doing so rolls on unstoppably in the USA.
- hef19898 5y ago
  I have both, two modern cars with services all 30k km and one from the 80s with motor oil changes every 5k, gearbox oil every 10k and axles every 10k as well. Not to mention that modern gearboxes and exles tend to be greased for life.
- city41 5y ago
  A factor is oil change shops still put a sticker on the windshield that says to come back in 3000 miles. It's of course in their interest for people to change their oil too often.
dotancohen 5y ago
Thanks, I updated the post. I had no idea that oil changes are now once every two years. On the wife's Subaru I still change the oil every six months, and I remember when the standard was actually every three months. She puts about 10 km on the car during those six months, we live in a hilltop village half an hour drive from a city.
- PinguTS 5y ago
  What? Oil change every three month? WTF is wrong with the US industry? The very same cars in Europe will have an oil change every 2 years or so. My Volvo S60 Model 2000 has an oil change every 3 years. There must be something that you get sold on by marketing that is so wrong. BTW. Also a Tesla has oil in their gearbox, even if it is just a single gear integrated into the single unit combined with motor and inverter. For a Model S it is recommend to replace it every 12.5k miles, which is exactly the very same recommendation as with other car model.
  - maxerickson 5y ago
    Without meaning to argue that it is necessary, it persists because it just isn't that big a cost. Gas isn't the largest cost of ownership and 5,000 miles of cheap US gas is still ~10x the cost of an oil change.
  - dotancohen 5y ago
    I'm not in the US, but I have lived there and I did learn that frequency there. Like I mentioned in another thread, I worked as a service technician at Ford and that was the recommendation then (1990s). As for the Model S fluid change, thank you for mentioning it, I did not know that. I believe that there is no fluid change interval defined on the Model 3, which I just recently bought.
    - kube-system 5y ago
      There are many gasoline vehicles that specify no fluid changes for certain parts, infamously, transmissions. Longer lasting synthetic fluids allow them to advertise lower maintenance costs, but they still do wear out. They’d rather the transmission wears out after 150k miles anyway.

How many miles are you putting on that i10?! An oil change is every 2 years or 15k km. I think it’s a bad example btw, it’s a famously reliable car (the taxi of choice in Bogota fwiw)

bluedino 5y ago

Many Americans drive 15k (9,000 miles) in 6 months

Ekaros 5y ago

Even in Finland it is one oil change a year, and that includes proper winters... The price difference buys lot of maintenance. And gas...

Retric 5y ago
The i10 is a rather low end car, but the upgrade could be worth it. Finland gas prices are 8.464 USD/gallon right now. That’s unusually high but assuming 200k miles at say 35 mpg that adds up to 48,000 USD in gas over the lifetime of the vehicle. Not that electricity is free or that we have long term cost data, but I suspect the EV / plug in hybrid premium is a very easy choice in Finland.
- oblio 5y ago
  I was curious so I did some math about this. The average car life in Finland seems to be 15.6 years (let's round that to 16, helping the case for EVs). The average distance traveled by Finnish cars, based on 2018 data, is about 13600km per year (let's make that 14000km per year, also helping the case for EVs). That works out to 224k km over the lifetime of a car. That's only 140k miles. Regarding your 35mpg (was 30mpg before the edit), that's 6.7l per 100km (7.8 before edit), let's make that 7l per 100km (and 8 before edit), further helping the case for EVs. But in reality a small car such as the i10 probably uses more like 5-5.5l per 100km (40-45mpg). Then the gas price is super high due to the Covid economic bounceback coupled with the supply chain issues plus the latest conflict. I'd say your numbers are too optimistic plus they're for the entire lifetime of the car. The average owner probably has the car for half that duration, at best. So they don't really care about the entire lifetime. Still, things seem to be getting closer than 10 years ago, for example. The really bad thing is the upfront price. There's no comparable EV in the i10 price range, which is a very cheap car (we're talking about a car around €12k).
  - Retric 5y ago
    I actually looked it up. 35 MPG is perhaps generous when their 2021 cars are averaging 30.9MPG, but it’s a low sample size. https://www.fuelly.com/car/hyundai/grand_i10 https://www.fuelly.com/car/hyundai/grand_i10 Finland imports a lot of used cars but: “An average car in the fleet 12.6 years of age” that suggest the car actually lasts to ~25.2 years. It’s not that simple because again they are importing and exporting used cars. https://www.aut.fi/files/2524/Annual_statistics_of_car_market_Finland_0301_2022.pdf https://www.aut.fi/files/2524/Annual_statistics_of_car_marke...
  - namdnay 5y ago
    > There's no comparable EV in the i10 price range there is now! I'm seeing the Dacia Spring appear everywhere - probably because it starts at only 13k in France including the ecobonus (I think base price is 16-17k). This is an absolute game-changer
    - oblio 5y ago
      I'm curious about it, but let's see how far the uptake goes. Where are you located?
      - CRConrad 5y ago
        > Where are you located? Given the GP's >> it starts at only 13k in France including the ecobonus (I think base price is 16-17k). I'd guess France.

pja 5y ago

For some reason people in the US are obsessed with changing the oil in their vehicle. Modern engines & oils don't need the oil changing every 3000 miles, but the folklore belief in the necessity of doing so rolls on unstoppably in the USA.

hef19898 5y ago
I have both, two modern cars with services all 30k km and one from the 80s with motor oil changes every 5k, gearbox oil every 10k and axles every 10k as well. Not to mention that modern gearboxes and exles tend to be greased for life.
city41 5y ago
A factor is oil change shops still put a sticker on the windshield that says to come back in 3000 miles. It's of course in their interest for people to change their oil too often.

dotancohen 5y ago

Thanks, I updated the post. I had no idea that oil changes are now once every two years. On the wife's Subaru I still change the oil every six months, and I remember when the standard was actually every three months. She puts about 10 km on the car during those six months, we live in a hilltop village half an hour drive from a city.

PinguTS 5y ago
What? Oil change every three month? WTF is wrong with the US industry? The very same cars in Europe will have an oil change every 2 years or so. My Volvo S60 Model 2000 has an oil change every 3 years. There must be something that you get sold on by marketing that is so wrong. BTW. Also a Tesla has oil in their gearbox, even if it is just a single gear integrated into the single unit combined with motor and inverter. For a Model S it is recommend to replace it every 12.5k miles, which is exactly the very same recommendation as with other car model.
- maxerickson 5y ago
  Without meaning to argue that it is necessary, it persists because it just isn't that big a cost. Gas isn't the largest cost of ownership and 5,000 miles of cheap US gas is still ~10x the cost of an oil change.
- dotancohen 5y ago
  I'm not in the US, but I have lived there and I did learn that frequency there. Like I mentioned in another thread, I worked as a service technician at Ford and that was the recommendation then (1990s). As for the Model S fluid change, thank you for mentioning it, I did not know that. I believe that there is no fluid change interval defined on the Model 3, which I just recently bought.
  - kube-system 5y ago
    There are many gasoline vehicles that specify no fluid changes for certain parts, infamously, transmissions. Longer lasting synthetic fluids allow them to advertise lower maintenance costs, but they still do wear out. They’d rather the transmission wears out after 150k miles anyway.