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In terms of language C# always seemed to me like it was a language that expects you to use a (the) IDE, much like Delphi. Which is really unfortunate in my opin

In terms of language C# always seemed to me like it was a language that expects you to use a (the) IDE, much like Delphi. Which is really unfortunate in my opinion, because I usually read code outside an IDE and also spend more time strictly reading code than writing.

cm2187 5y ago
Don't you want an IDE to navigate through the code (go to definition/implementation, find all references, etc)?
- javcasas 5y ago
  Not sure about you, but I prefer environments that can be navigated without IDEs so that when I add IDEs and tools I become an overpowered developer; instead of having to add the best tools available just to become an average developer.
  - manigandham 5y ago
    All environments can be navigated without IDEs. You can write code in notepad, it's just text after all. The tools don't make the developer, and the truly expert developers focus on productivity and results, regardless of environments.
    - javcasas 5y ago
      Yup, all environments can be navigated with notepad, but some environments are easier to navigate than others. For example, Yaml vs unindented Json. They represent the same, yet in one I can see what's going on with the indentation, and in the other I have to go hunting for closing braces.
blaxis 5y ago
doesn't help that the delphi IDE isn't very good
- branko_d 5y ago
  Back in the day, Delphi had the best form designer by far, which to this day is still unsurpassed in some aspects (visual component inheritance anyone?). The code-oriented portion of the IDE was also decent, IIRC, with very fast edit-compile-debug loop (something Borland was traditionally good at from TurboPascal days), a capable debugger, and excellent hyperlinked and contextual documentation. But I haven't used it in more than two decades and it makes me sad if it's really true that it's no longer good.
  - hackerfromthefu 5y ago
    Winforms supports Visual component inheritance, though not as nicely as Delphi used to around V3-5 which I used. I also loved Delphi's WebBroker technology, their visual web components were awesome and that tech was so far ahead of it's time I still pine for it. Was writing compiled ISAPI web performance, with fast development, huge amount of high quality libraries, and hot reload! In the year 2000! The only tradeoff was manual memory management, and I guess lack of generics and LINQ.
rhplus 5y ago
How is this different to any other language that uses more than one source file to define a program?
- formerly_proven 5y ago
  using Foo; using Bar; using Baz; // somewhere else var foo = new Bublicon(...); // where tf does this come from? vs. use std::option::Option::{Some, None}; // ... Some(1234) // clearly std::option::Option::Some which I can then go find easily
  - branko_d 5y ago
    > // where tf does this come from? Just hover over it, and you'll find out. Or Ctrl+click to navigate to its implementation, possibly decompiling from IL if the source is not available. > use std::option::Option:: C# can accomplish similar effect through using alias directive.

cm2187 5y ago

Don't you want an IDE to navigate through the code (go to definition/implementation, find all references, etc)?

javcasas 5y ago
Not sure about you, but I prefer environments that can be navigated without IDEs so that when I add IDEs and tools I become an overpowered developer; instead of having to add the best tools available just to become an average developer.
- manigandham 5y ago
  All environments can be navigated without IDEs. You can write code in notepad, it's just text after all. The tools don't make the developer, and the truly expert developers focus on productivity and results, regardless of environments.
  - javcasas 5y ago
    Yup, all environments can be navigated with notepad, but some environments are easier to navigate than others. For example, Yaml vs unindented Json. They represent the same, yet in one I can see what's going on with the indentation, and in the other I have to go hunting for closing braces.

blaxis 5y ago

doesn't help that the delphi IDE isn't very good

branko_d 5y ago
Back in the day, Delphi had the best form designer by far, which to this day is still unsurpassed in some aspects (visual component inheritance anyone?). The code-oriented portion of the IDE was also decent, IIRC, with very fast edit-compile-debug loop (something Borland was traditionally good at from TurboPascal days), a capable debugger, and excellent hyperlinked and contextual documentation. But I haven't used it in more than two decades and it makes me sad if it's really true that it's no longer good.
- hackerfromthefu 5y ago
  Winforms supports Visual component inheritance, though not as nicely as Delphi used to around V3-5 which I used. I also loved Delphi's WebBroker technology, their visual web components were awesome and that tech was so far ahead of it's time I still pine for it. Was writing compiled ISAPI web performance, with fast development, huge amount of high quality libraries, and hot reload! In the year 2000! The only tradeoff was manual memory management, and I guess lack of generics and LINQ.

rhplus 5y ago

How is this different to any other language that uses more than one source file to define a program?

formerly_proven 5y ago
using Foo; using Bar; using Baz; // somewhere else var foo = new Bublicon(...); // where tf does this come from? vs. use std::option::Option::{Some, None}; // ... Some(1234) // clearly std::option::Option::Some which I can then go find easily
- branko_d 5y ago
  > // where tf does this come from? Just hover over it, and you'll find out. Or Ctrl+click to navigate to its implementation, possibly decompiling from IL if the source is not available. > use std::option::Option:: C# can accomplish similar effect through using alias directive.