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Russia is abandoning SSL certs in favor of their own
- boznz 5y agoThey are really going all in 100% North Korea.. Not going to end well
- trevorboaconstr 5y agoI suspect Russia will soon enough find itself closely intertwined with Chinese ecosystems and standards. I think Putin has envy for Xi’s autocratic-techno-state and wishes to emulate it. What better way than to become a part of it.
- rektide 5y agoThankfully we're not seeing a total fuck-off-world axis forming here, a 100% antagonist alliance-versus-world relationship forming. China has recently refused to resupply parts for the Russian air transport systems[1] (so claims Russia). I don't think you are wrong at all. But I don't think this intertwining will be as mutually desired & reinforcing as Russia might perhaps have hoped. [1] https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/russia-says-china-refuses-supply-aircraft-parts-after-sanctions-2022-03-10/ https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/russia-sa...
- mytailorisrich 5y agoMore broadly, I think what's happening vindicates China's strategy and will be a watershed moment. We're seeing that most key global infrastructures for telecoms, internet, finance, etc. and pretty much all global tech companies are controlled by the USA and that they will weaponise everything against you as they see fit. The logical conclusion is that, if you can, you should build your own alternatives, which is what China has been doing. Things are going to become more fragmented from now on.
- signatoremo 5y agoChina have done it because they have superpower ambition, and because they can. There are areas where they still haven’t been able to do the same such as jet engine. Also, not everyone can build their own. Most of the world will continue to use the current one. Some other like Russia will use China’s one. Do you think China will be less aggressive than the US in weaponizing everything against you as they see fit? Russia will be a lesser partner to China. The dream of Russia Empire glory will still be a dream only.
- erichocean 5y ago> Russia will be a lesser partner to China. This is such an American/Anglo point of view, who can only think in terms of empire, master/slave, etc. As an American, it's clear we're making increasingly poor and erratic decisions because we simply refuse to understand that there isn't one universal culture (Western) that everyone should have, and if they don't, they're evil. We've done a lot of feel-good things in response to Russia's military operation in Ukraine, but I don't think it works out well in the end. America is significantly weaker because of the actions we've already taken, and I'm confident we'll double down a few dozen more times before things stabilize again. BRICS countries can sense the opportunity Russia's isolation by the West has given them.
- idiotsecant 5y ago> This is such an American/Anglo point of view, who can only think in terms of empire, master/slave, etc. No, this is a human point of view. China has been consistently engaged in this exact practice since before the idea of 'China' even really existed. Strong groups will ultimately culturally / economically / militarily subsume weaker ones. It's how families grow into tribes grow into federations grow into city-states grow into nations grow into empires. China well and truly understands how this works. Pretending that everyone on the continent is actually Han Chinese is practically the state religion, for good reason - it helps to expand the in-group and galvanize the tribe against the out-group for the purpose of perpetuating the above cycle. It's fashionable to pretend that western imperialism is the only imperialism. It's only because the west is so good at cultural and economic imperialism (and rarely actual military imperialism) that people make this point. The west is generally successful at spreading it's values because people want to adopt those values. The same is not true of more autocratic systems.
- polski-g 5y agoChina will be collecting vassal states like I do in EU4. But eventually the vassal swarm will be powerful enough for a WC.
- DwnVoteHoneyPot 5y agowhat is EU4? what is WC?
- DwnVoteHoneyPot 5y agoYeah with Russia cut off from rest of world, it'll be cheaper for China to take Russian resources such as oil, nickel. Russia will rely on Chinese manufacturing and technology. On the finance side, Russia need China for gov't debt and corporate debt and payments system. All this allows China more power to control Russia (e.g., sanction Russia when they fall out of line).
- dzhiurgis 5y agoRussia is like 4% of China’s gdp. If they get enough sanctions soon enough they’ll not going to step into that shit.
- TechBro8615 5y agoIt's not that extreme. They have the BRICS sphere of influence on their side. More likely, the SWIFT sanctions will prove a mistake for "the West," when it realizes the downstream effects of cutting off Russia from the dominant payment network of the global reserve currency. Russian banks have already started offering accounts in yuan. This will lead to further balkanization (unfortunate pun notwithstanding) of world reserve currencies, which means increased decentralization and a reduced dependency on the dollar. Eventually the world will naturally diversify their reserve holdings to the point that the dollar loses its power as leverage in diplomatic negotiations. At this point, there will be jockeying for position of a dominant currency, and it will be more than just fiat currency in the race. In the next 5 years, we will almost certainly see the emergence of a central bank digital currency. Within the next 10 years, it will be clear that paper USD will not be the dominant currency in 2040, and it will likely be obvious which currency will take its place. As far as the SSL certs go, all these arguments also apply to balkanization of internet infrastructure. In fact, they'll happen together, since the information networks banning Russians refuse to interface with their payment networks anyway. Is this actually the greatest opportunity for Russian entrepreneurs since the fall of the Soviet Union? Suddenly there is demand for an alternative to every Western online service. The products that were previously 80% as good as their Western counterparts now find themselves as the leading option in the local market. This same pattern happened in China when they introduced The Great Firewall — the censorship regime favored local providers, so they had a route to catch up with the Silicon Valley companies. Now look at the Chinese internet economy. Russia doesn't have nearly the population of China, nor the population growth that China did the past twenty years, but it's not unreasonable to expect significant growth in Russian internet sector over the next 5-10 years (after the dust settles on sanctions and the winners emerge).
- rosndo 5y ago> They have the BRICS sphere of influence on their side. So and so, my banks in BRICS countries are refusing to accept incoming transfers from Russian banks. At least in China, India and the UAE Russian money seems to be a no-go. Pretty sure other BRICS countries are only providing moral support at this point.
- Salgat 5y ago
- supergirl 5y agothe USSR didn't do too bad. NK just didn't start with much. Russia has a lot of tech. but look at NK: they have internet, developed nuclear weapons, trying to launch satellites, surviving covid (I assume), did not get invaded by US, still chugging along
- VincentEvans 5y agoOh yeah, NK isn’t that bad. USSR didn’t do too badly… USSR in 90ies was equivalent technologically to the West in 60ies-70ies. I was born in USSR. And when I got to travel Europe in the 90ies - the difference was astounding. And one other thing… That was me comparing capital cities of USSRs western republics. If you take your average outskirt towns on the periphery away from Moscow influence and power - the difference was more like 30-40 years of development.
- supergirl 5y agoconsidering USSR got the brunt of WW2, it's not that bad. peak of USSR was in the 60s anyway, so you should compare at that time. in the 90s, USSR didn't exist anymore
- CRConrad 5y ago> considering USSR got the brunt of WW2, Well, except for, you know... Germany.
- VincentEvans 5y agoOk, lets settle on it’s not “that” bad then. My wife who grew up poor hispanic in Brooklyn is humored that we didn’t have a washing machine in the 90ies while living in the capital, drying clothes on the balcony (or bathroom in the winter). She even had a Nintendo!
- clearcoat 5y agoNorth Korea started with the "better" part of Korea by most measures, having far more natural resources than the southern portion of the peninsula as well as more arable land. All things being equal, they "ought" to be the richer country.
- nikolay 5y ago
- pumpkinprog 5y agoAs it said in the article, the backstory of this move is that DigiCert revoked SSL certificates of some major Russian banks that come under the US sanctions, including their Central Bank (the Russian Fed). And all their sites, remote banking, 3-D secure pages went down for some time immediately. IMO it is a pretty understandable move for the Russians as a national security measure not to depend on some random American companies switching off Russian critical infrastructure.
- SlavikCA 5y agoI think this is good example, that sanction can have undesired effect. If the goal was to interrupt commerce - I guess it was interrupted for a day or two. But now: - Russia is pushed to double efforts to achieve independence from Western infrastructure - Freedom advocates in the West now have very clear example, that even SSL certs can be used to silence (to cancel) anyone - The next logical step for Russia (I think they are doing it already) is to build it's own SSL infrastructure. And probably DNS, too. West probably not going to trust it, so it will result that people in the West and in Russia & East will have limited means of communication (China scenario), which is net negative for both Russia, but negative for the West, too.
- diordiderot 5y agoThe west will be fine. Brains will drain and resources will extracted at their market price. Russia will be one more 3rd world country who's only cost is loss of human potential much like DPRK or DRK
- nikolay 5y agoHave you ever been to Russia or China?
- dzhiurgis 5y agoI’ve been to both. They’ve modernised, but everything is gloomy and fake.
- nikolay 5y agoOh, and the garden gnomes here and the fake Eiffel Tower in Las Vegas are authentic?! Considering their Communist past, just look 20 years from now and let's see who's laughing then!
- dzhiurgis 5y agoYou can protest in front of fake fake Eiffel Tower in Vegas. In Russia and China you get sent to gulag.
- kubatyszko 5y agoThey should also roll their own crypto...
- throwawaymanbot 5y ago
- stjohnswarts 5y agoIn other words the government reads and records everything you do online.
- 0xdeadb00f 5y agoYou say this as if to imply they don't already.