12 ms·

An interesting possible long term consequence of this is having top tier free and open source commercial alternatives coming out of Russia. Nationalized piracy

by mrits 5y ago

An interesting possible long term consequence of this is having top tier free and open source commercial alternatives coming out of Russia. Nationalized piracy would also pour over into the West and we'd probably see people here getting software updates from Moscow.

KptMarchewa 5y ago
No top tier code when anyone with half a brain and sufficient resources is trying to escape that totalitarian hellhole.
- dijonman2 5y ago
  - not2b 5y ago
    You keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means.
    - wpasc 5y ago
      filibuster
  - kahrl 5y ago
    US and Canada have issues, yes, but these issues are not in the same ballpark as Russia. Not even in the same league. This is such an insane false equivalence.
    - mc32 5y ago
      True; still we had politicians advocating jail time and seizure of assets as well as declaration of emergency powers to quell what were peaceful protests.
  - KptMarchewa 5y ago
    Yeah, having to wear a mask is definitely comparable to 15 years of gulag for calling war a war. Wretched.
    - dijonman2 5y ago
      It’s not as different as you think. Feel free to disagree, I hope I’m wrong. Short circuiting due process just because you happen to agree is a very slippery slope.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
jaynetics 5y ago
> we'd probably see people here getting software updates from Moscow That sounds very possible, but not very advisable.
- brabel 5y ago
  It's not very advisable, but if anything, this crisis is showing that's not advisable to rely on any other country at all for your crucial infrastructure... if we go back to isolationism, one of the main deterrents to international conflicts, interdependence, will be weakened, which can't be good for peace in the coming decades.
  - Sebb767 5y ago
    > if we go back to isolationism, one of the main deterrents to international conflicts, interdependence, will be weakened, which can't be good for peace in the coming decades. On the other hand, if you completely ignore tensions and keep up the supply in the case of war, interdependence ceases to be a deterrent at all. The real problem here is that somebody started a war; the isolationism is just one of the many bad consequences.
  - AniseAbyss 5y ago
    There is a cost for isolationism. I am sure it is possible to make Xbox controllers in the US instead of China but they'll be 200 dollars. And then there is things like coffee and rice which would be almost impossible to produce at scale. We will always have global trade.
  - Etherlord87 5y ago
    > It's not very advisable, but if anything, this crisis is showing that's not advisable to rely on any other country at all for your crucial infrastructure... Or maybe it's showing that it indeed is quite optimal to rely on other countries for your crucial infrastructure - it's just not advisable to anger those countries by breaking international treaties and committing war crimes? Having to resign from this optimal strategy and isolating yourself is exactly the war deterrent that sanctions are supposed to achieve.
gremlinsinc 5y ago
Yeah, I love open source alternatives from an autocratic state with backdoors and all kind of nasty stuff inside, and no oversight or ability to sue, as well as possibility of sanctions by association.
- uspec2 5y ago
  - onemoresoop 5y ago
    At least you still have a public outcry when backdoors are found out. Though whistleblowers tend to have a bad fate regardless of the side they're on I think they will at least not be point blank executed like the journalists executed on Putin's birthday. The west is heading in a bad direction too, no doubt about that, but Russia and China are already at an extremely dangerous level of totalitarianism and censorship.
  - CamperBob2 5y ago
    If submitting a bug report against Dual_EC_DRBG got you exiled to a gulag, your false-equivalence exercise might have some validity.
    - tsol 5y ago
      Even in Russia, submitting a bug report won't get you sent to Siberia. America's goals align more closely with the majority of readers here than Russia's goals do, but ultimately neither situation is ideal considering the lack of privacy inherit in this goals
- UberFly 5y ago
  Wouldn't the fact that it's open source make the spiders in the code easy to see?
  - jjice 5y ago
    They'd be visible, if it was noticed. Bugs get introduced to OSS all the time just because sometimes it's hard to review code 100% accurately. Replace bugs with truly malicious code and the same applies. If you told me I use OSS on a daily basis that has some sort of malicious code that slipped though the cracks, I'd believe it just due to the shear amount of code running on any machine.
cuteboy19 5y ago
Piracy and open source are orthogonal concepts. If anything piracy removes the main driver for having open source: free stuff
- mrits 5y ago
  There are various licensing models for open source. I'd consider piracy to be violating any of them.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
trhway 5y ago
Funny idea, yet unrealistic. The capable Russians will make their way to the near by countries. The Russia will fall behind. To the comment below : >everyone becomes poorer it will slow as people simply won't be able to afford to leave the things have worked in opposite way - the brain drain of 199x slowed by ~2003/5 as economic situation improved until 2014/5 when it started to pickup again. Of course visa issues and potential "iron curtain", etc. will affect it.
- LAC-Tech 5y ago
  Brain Drain in Russia is nothing new. I'd imagine there'll be an initial spike in the rate of it, but as sanctions take effect and everyone becomes poorer it will slow as people simply won't be able to afford to leave. Or are they even able to - are there increased visa restrictions yet?
- int_19h 5y ago
  If you want to brain drain Russia, it would help to not e.g. block Aeroflot flights from Russia.
  - trhway 5y ago
    One can easily train/bus into Finland or Poland.
    - throw-ru-938 5y ago
      No you cannot, all land borders have been closed by Russia since 2020 because Covid.
    - yc12340 5y ago
      Land borders are closed: https://www.consultant.ru/document/cons_doc_LAW_348748/ https://www.consultant.ru/document/cons_doc_LAW_348748/
      - trhway 5y ago
        it says that seaports are fine, so ferry from St-Petersburg to Helsinski for example.
forinti 5y ago
I once attended a talk by a Cuban Linux user who said that free software didn't get much traction in Cuba because pirating was completely acceptable and widespread.
- int_19h 5y ago
  It was similar in Russia back in 90s and early 00s, when anti-piracy enforcement was almost non-existent.
- mrits 5y ago
  With respect to Cuba, they don't have a space program.
- Etherlord87 5y ago
  I think without piracy Linux would be installed on 90% of desktops two-three decades ago.

by mrits 5y ago

KptMarchewa 5y ago

No top tier code when anyone with half a brain and sufficient resources is trying to escape that totalitarian hellhole.

dijonman2 5y ago
- not2b 5y ago
  You keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means.
  - wpasc 5y ago
    filibuster
- kahrl 5y ago
  US and Canada have issues, yes, but these issues are not in the same ballpark as Russia. Not even in the same league. This is such an insane false equivalence.
  - mc32 5y ago
    True; still we had politicians advocating jail time and seizure of assets as well as declaration of emergency powers to quell what were peaceful protests.
- KptMarchewa 5y ago
  Yeah, having to wear a mask is definitely comparable to 15 years of gulag for calling war a war. Wretched.
  - dijonman2 5y ago
    It’s not as different as you think. Feel free to disagree, I hope I’m wrong. Short circuiting due process just because you happen to agree is a very slippery slope.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

jaynetics 5y ago

> we'd probably see people here getting software updates from Moscow That sounds very possible, but not very advisable.

brabel 5y ago
It's not very advisable, but if anything, this crisis is showing that's not advisable to rely on any other country at all for your crucial infrastructure... if we go back to isolationism, one of the main deterrents to international conflicts, interdependence, will be weakened, which can't be good for peace in the coming decades.
- Sebb767 5y ago
  > if we go back to isolationism, one of the main deterrents to international conflicts, interdependence, will be weakened, which can't be good for peace in the coming decades. On the other hand, if you completely ignore tensions and keep up the supply in the case of war, interdependence ceases to be a deterrent at all. The real problem here is that somebody started a war; the isolationism is just one of the many bad consequences.
- AniseAbyss 5y ago
  There is a cost for isolationism. I am sure it is possible to make Xbox controllers in the US instead of China but they'll be 200 dollars. And then there is things like coffee and rice which would be almost impossible to produce at scale. We will always have global trade.
- Etherlord87 5y ago
  > It's not very advisable, but if anything, this crisis is showing that's not advisable to rely on any other country at all for your crucial infrastructure... Or maybe it's showing that it indeed is quite optimal to rely on other countries for your crucial infrastructure - it's just not advisable to anger those countries by breaking international treaties and committing war crimes? Having to resign from this optimal strategy and isolating yourself is exactly the war deterrent that sanctions are supposed to achieve.

gremlinsinc 5y ago

Yeah, I love open source alternatives from an autocratic state with backdoors and all kind of nasty stuff inside, and no oversight or ability to sue, as well as possibility of sanctions by association.

uspec2 5y ago
- onemoresoop 5y ago
  At least you still have a public outcry when backdoors are found out. Though whistleblowers tend to have a bad fate regardless of the side they're on I think they will at least not be point blank executed like the journalists executed on Putin's birthday. The west is heading in a bad direction too, no doubt about that, but Russia and China are already at an extremely dangerous level of totalitarianism and censorship.
- CamperBob2 5y ago
  If submitting a bug report against Dual_EC_DRBG got you exiled to a gulag, your false-equivalence exercise might have some validity.
  - tsol 5y ago
    Even in Russia, submitting a bug report won't get you sent to Siberia. America's goals align more closely with the majority of readers here than Russia's goals do, but ultimately neither situation is ideal considering the lack of privacy inherit in this goals
UberFly 5y ago
Wouldn't the fact that it's open source make the spiders in the code easy to see?
- jjice 5y ago
  They'd be visible, if it was noticed. Bugs get introduced to OSS all the time just because sometimes it's hard to review code 100% accurately. Replace bugs with truly malicious code and the same applies. If you told me I use OSS on a daily basis that has some sort of malicious code that slipped though the cracks, I'd believe it just due to the shear amount of code running on any machine.

cuteboy19 5y ago

Piracy and open source are orthogonal concepts. If anything piracy removes the main driver for having open source: free stuff

mrits 5y ago
There are various licensing models for open source. I'd consider piracy to be violating any of them.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

trhway 5y ago

Funny idea, yet unrealistic. The capable Russians will make their way to the near by countries. The Russia will fall behind. To the comment below : >everyone becomes poorer it will slow as people simply won't be able to afford to leave the things have worked in opposite way - the brain drain of 199x slowed by ~2003/5 as economic situation improved until 2014/5 when it started to pickup again. Of course visa issues and potential "iron curtain", etc. will affect it.

LAC-Tech 5y ago
Brain Drain in Russia is nothing new. I'd imagine there'll be an initial spike in the rate of it, but as sanctions take effect and everyone becomes poorer it will slow as people simply won't be able to afford to leave. Or are they even able to - are there increased visa restrictions yet?
int_19h 5y ago
If you want to brain drain Russia, it would help to not e.g. block Aeroflot flights from Russia.
- trhway 5y ago
  One can easily train/bus into Finland or Poland.
  - throw-ru-938 5y ago
    No you cannot, all land borders have been closed by Russia since 2020 because Covid.
  - yc12340 5y ago
    Land borders are closed: https://www.consultant.ru/document/cons_doc_LAW_348748/ https://www.consultant.ru/document/cons_doc_LAW_348748/
    - trhway 5y ago
      it says that seaports are fine, so ferry from St-Petersburg to Helsinski for example.

forinti 5y ago

I once attended a talk by a Cuban Linux user who said that free software didn't get much traction in Cuba because pirating was completely acceptable and widespread.

int_19h 5y ago
It was similar in Russia back in 90s and early 00s, when anti-piracy enforcement was almost non-existent.
mrits 5y ago
With respect to Cuba, they don't have a space program.
Etherlord87 5y ago
I think without piracy Linux would be installed on 90% of desktops two-three decades ago.