2 ms·

While I agree on the premise of gaining and retaining power and the importance of a loyal base to that end, I think reducing loyalty to wealth redistribution is

by jmyeet 5y ago

While I agree on the premise of gaining and retaining power and the importance of a loyal base to that end, I think reducing loyalty to wealth redistribution is overly simplistic and insufficient. Humans like any social creatures are prone to tribalism. Social cretures crave a sense of belonging and that means defining who you are, what you want and what you stand for and finding similarly minded individuals. Maintaining that group involves signaling one's "belonging". Tribalism can be along racial, cultural, religious or language grounds but it can also be more ephemeral than that. Take the popularity of Trump, particularly among evangelicals and other "values" voters. Now for anyone familiar with even a modicum of Christian orthodoxy, Trump seen through the lens of Christian morals is objectively a horrible human being. Many of us find this hypocrisy perplexing but seen through the lens of tribalism I think it makes more sense. Trump, through carefully chosen wedge issues like guns and abortion, provides and reinforces that sense of belonging to that group. It reinforces the "us and them" and "we are warriors for Christ" world views that are deeply-ingrained and pervasive. Beyond Trump, you have Putin. Some evangelicals believe God is working through Putin [1]. Tucker Carlson last week went on a rant about Putin never did [insert imagine liberal sin here], a video that is oddly hard to find now and Carlson has been forced to backtrack on given the invasion. Nationalism is another common road to tribalism. But none of this really involves the transfer of material goods as this post focuses on. [1]: https://www.newsweek.com/retired-evangelist-pat-robertson-says-putin-fulfilling-biblical-prophecy-1683497 https://www.newsweek.com/retired-evangelist-pat-robertson-sa...

syshum 5y ago
Ignoring the economic aspects Trump is foolish as well. Trump either due to action or circumstance also directly lead to better conditions for the Working Class via low inflation low employment, and reducing environmental regulations that allowed increasing in many blue collar jobs. to be clear these effects are likely not a result of anything trump did directly but mere circumstance of timing, however is credited by the very people you are calling "values voters" with improving their economic position while at the same time supporting their values In contrast, again correctly or not, the Actions of Democrats led by Joe Biden are seen as directly increasing inflation, gas prices, and worsing their economic situation. I still firmly believes elections are always about economics, if you believe person A will make you better off economically you vote for them, or if you believe Person A will make you worse off economically you vote against them.. 2020 was probably the first election in a long time that upends that mold where it was not about economics...
- alar44 5y ago
  - I still firmly believes elections are always about economics, if you believe person A will make you better off economically you vote for them, or if you believe Person A will make you worse off economically you vote against them.. This is literally the last thing I consider. I'm not an economist, hell, even economists can't tell you the outcomes of changing certain fiscal policies. I vote on social issues alone, which obviously has overlap with economic prosperity, but whether or not some politician will save me 1% on my income or property tax is not on my radar whatsoever. The opportunity cost to that savings is normally much higher than some fraction of a percent of money I get to keep. That 1% doesn't affect my life in any meaningful way, but cutting school taxes or something does, in a much greater effect, over a much greater time period, and a wider geographical area.
daniel-cussen 5y ago
No man has been slandered more than Trump, in his own country, while he is alive and in power. Among the most slandered by any reckoning, largely because of telecommunications advances and the impunity with which slander can be carried out since the last Supreme Court ruling during the civil rights movement of the 1960s. Believing the most slander in history leads directly to the belief he is the worst person in history.

by jmyeet 5y ago

syshum 5y ago

Ignoring the economic aspects Trump is foolish as well. Trump either due to action or circumstance also directly lead to better conditions for the Working Class via low inflation low employment, and reducing environmental regulations that allowed increasing in many blue collar jobs. to be clear these effects are likely not a result of anything trump did directly but mere circumstance of timing, however is credited by the very people you are calling "values voters" with improving their economic position while at the same time supporting their values In contrast, again correctly or not, the Actions of Democrats led by Joe Biden are seen as directly increasing inflation, gas prices, and worsing their economic situation. I still firmly believes elections are always about economics, if you believe person A will make you better off economically you vote for them, or if you believe Person A will make you worse off economically you vote against them.. 2020 was probably the first election in a long time that upends that mold where it was not about economics...

alar44 5y ago
- I still firmly believes elections are always about economics, if you believe person A will make you better off economically you vote for them, or if you believe Person A will make you worse off economically you vote against them.. This is literally the last thing I consider. I'm not an economist, hell, even economists can't tell you the outcomes of changing certain fiscal policies. I vote on social issues alone, which obviously has overlap with economic prosperity, but whether or not some politician will save me 1% on my income or property tax is not on my radar whatsoever. The opportunity cost to that savings is normally much higher than some fraction of a percent of money I get to keep. That 1% doesn't affect my life in any meaningful way, but cutting school taxes or something does, in a much greater effect, over a much greater time period, and a wider geographical area.

daniel-cussen 5y ago

No man has been slandered more than Trump, in his own country, while he is alive and in power. Among the most slandered by any reckoning, largely because of telecommunications advances and the impunity with which slander can be carried out since the last Supreme Court ruling during the civil rights movement of the 1960s. Believing the most slander in history leads directly to the belief he is the worst person in history.