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I've lived in Europe for a few years total without ever owning a car and rarely feeling the lack of one, which would be effectively impossible outside 2-3 citie

by themgt 5y ago

I've lived in Europe for a few years total without ever owning a car and rarely feeling the lack of one, which would be effectively impossible outside 2-3 cities in the USA. I would be highly in favor of completely overhauling US infrastructure into medium density walkable towns and cities and switching the ~300 million cars on the road to more fuel efficient models, but jacking up the price of gas by 3x in 18 months will just impoverish and immiserate millions of Americans who will have to choose between paying for gas vs. food, rent, health care. It's like saying this gym rat can squat 450 lbs and is much healthier for it, so you ought to get off the couch and squat 450 lbs tomorrow.

listless 5y ago
The US is way more spread out than Europe, and our current infrastructure gets a D+ rating. Necessity is the mother of invention, but we are seriously behind in terms of transit. This is going to hurt the US more than people expect. This is why I would be shocked to see a ban on Russian oil. We simply cannot absorb that shock to our economy. https://www.thecivilengineer.org/news-center/latest-news/item/1245-us-infrastructure-scores-a-d-more-than-4-5-trillion-need-to-be-invested-by-2025 https://www.thecivilengineer.org/news-center/latest-news/ite...
_0wip 5y ago
> I've lived in Europe for a few years total without ever owning a car and rarely feeling the lack of one, which would be effectively impossible outside 2-3 cities in the USA. If one picks where they live carefully, I think most people could go car-free much easier than they believe. I have never owned a car and mostly ride a bike for transportation. I have lived in rural Maryland, the DC suburbs, Austin, Baltimore, and Buffalo. Of those places the only one where I found a car was necessary was rural Maryland. I would use a ride-sharing service periodically in the worse cities like Buffalo. Yes, the particular neighborhood may be more expensive, but in my experience having a car costs a fair bit more than the increase in rent from living in a more expensive neighborhood. (Note that I'm saying that a small number of individuals can go car-free more easily than they believe. Once a huge number of people start doing this, however, I'm sure it would run into problems.)
TMWNN 5y ago
>I've lived in Europe for a few years total without ever owning a car and rarely feeling the lack of one You lived in a big European city. Feel free to tell someone living in rural France, or Ireland, that they must live without an automobile.
- vinni2 5y ago
  It’s not impossible. Public transport is generally good in most European towns and cities. I have lived in second tier European cities for 12 years without needing to own a car. I still occasionally rent cars when I need to transport a lot of stuff.
- themgt 5y ago
  Feel free to tell someone living in rural France, or Ireland, that they must live without an automobile. Well, I didn't. I lived in European towns/cities from ~10k to 350k people. Rural areas exist obviously but compared to US suburbs or even most US urban areas we're talking far far smaller % of people who need a car for most aspects of day-to-day life in Europe.
__s 5y ago
For the most part I agree. Gas subsidy cuts / carbon tax needed to start years ago to gradually align incentives. As per usual those without wealth will be the most impacted by these price increases, because they're the least capable of adapting in short order

by themgt 5y ago

listless 5y ago

The US is way more spread out than Europe, and our current infrastructure gets a D+ rating. Necessity is the mother of invention, but we are seriously behind in terms of transit. This is going to hurt the US more than people expect. This is why I would be shocked to see a ban on Russian oil. We simply cannot absorb that shock to our economy. https://www.thecivilengineer.org/news-center/latest-news/item/1245-us-infrastructure-scores-a-d-more-than-4-5-trillion-need-to-be-invested-by-2025 https://www.thecivilengineer.org/news-center/latest-news/ite...

_0wip 5y ago

> I've lived in Europe for a few years total without ever owning a car and rarely feeling the lack of one, which would be effectively impossible outside 2-3 cities in the USA. If one picks where they live carefully, I think most people could go car-free much easier than they believe. I have never owned a car and mostly ride a bike for transportation. I have lived in rural Maryland, the DC suburbs, Austin, Baltimore, and Buffalo. Of those places the only one where I found a car was necessary was rural Maryland. I would use a ride-sharing service periodically in the worse cities like Buffalo. Yes, the particular neighborhood may be more expensive, but in my experience having a car costs a fair bit more than the increase in rent from living in a more expensive neighborhood. (Note that I'm saying that a small number of individuals can go car-free more easily than they believe. Once a huge number of people start doing this, however, I'm sure it would run into problems.)

TMWNN 5y ago

>I've lived in Europe for a few years total without ever owning a car and rarely feeling the lack of one You lived in a big European city. Feel free to tell someone living in rural France, or Ireland, that they must live without an automobile.

vinni2 5y ago
It’s not impossible. Public transport is generally good in most European towns and cities. I have lived in second tier European cities for 12 years without needing to own a car. I still occasionally rent cars when I need to transport a lot of stuff.
themgt 5y ago
Feel free to tell someone living in rural France, or Ireland, that they must live without an automobile. Well, I didn't. I lived in European towns/cities from ~10k to 350k people. Rural areas exist obviously but compared to US suburbs or even most US urban areas we're talking far far smaller % of people who need a car for most aspects of day-to-day life in Europe.

__s 5y ago

For the most part I agree. Gas subsidy cuts / carbon tax needed to start years ago to gradually align incentives. As per usual those without wealth will be the most impacted by these price increases, because they're the least capable of adapting in short order