4 ms·

That was solely, completely brought on by the owner class. When it was made a managerial decision to pay 20% more to a new non-experienced hire than your exper

That was solely, completely brought on by the owner class. When it was made a managerial decision to pay 20% more to a new non-experienced hire than your experienced developer, it makes 0 sense to not jump ship for your own 20% or more gain. Or at my previous job, management hired a headhunting firm. Contacted our developers at our company for a job at the same company. Paid $30k more. You can imagine just how fast devs were triaging from there. They lost hundreds of person-years of experience with that. Still are, too. Loyalty is punished. Why would anyone be loyal? I'm definitely in it for the money and benefits. The moment you screw me, I'm gone.

ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
Sadly, I can't argue with that. But I stayed at a company for 27 years, and never regretted it. This was because of the company, and what I got from the job (and also, what I didn't get). What I don't like, however, is people treating me with scorn, because of my loyalty, and personal ethics. I have lived a lifetime of the very highest Personal Integrity and Honor. It's not been easy, and I have definitely made many personal sacrifices, in order to stay true to my Principles. Anyone that has worked with me, is very much aware of my principles, and also my strong backbone. Being principled should, in no way, be mistaken for weakness, or lack of character. Just because the management are a bunch of dishonorable bastards, is no excuse -whatsoever- for becoming one, ourselves.
- noasaservice 5y ago
  In the end, employment is selling my time (which I cannot ever get back), for a pile of money. This pile of money, according to Marxian theory, is always less than the total value I bring. The owners keep the surplus, which is a massive amount above my pay. I will maximize my pile of money. You speak of ethics - and I will not engage in jobs which I believe are unethical. But it too is unethical to grossly underpay the people in your employ. But in corporations, ethics are downgraded to the minimum law in the jurisdiction. As for me, I am not a slave to a job. I show up and do work because there was an agreed-upon value for that work. The money buys my loyalty in the allotted blocks of time. No more, no less. When that agreement is no longer good, I renegotiate or look elsewhere. I am in an at-will state. They too can provide 0 notice to change the terms as well. Maybe in yesteryear, when long careers at a single company were common, that worked. I've heard the anecdotal Dickensian rags-to-riches stories of "Internal mail delivery guy becomes CEO". Those days, along with proper promotions, commensurate significant pay and benefit increases, and title are effectively gone. (I'm sure there's rare places that do that. Again, anecdotal and exceedingly rare.) My, my colleagues, and those around me MUST job-hop to get those raises and benefits. Not doing so is leaving massive piles of money to burn. And ethically speaking, making sure I assist in keeping my family in a good financial condition is of utmost ethics. Here in the US, the "social net" is abject from decades of hatred, ignorance, and utter lack of funding. The only social net I can count on is the one I create. As a white guy, there is no net if I fall. And there is no depth I stop at if in free-fall. I know that well. I see the homeless I used to live with when I go in town. And I'm intimately aware how easy my job can go poof and end up destitute. So yes, I see the landscape. I know the rules. And I will job-hop and will min-max my time and money. I create my own safety-net. I live significantly beneath my means to create a buffer. My loyalty is currently purchased in blocks of time 1/2 month long. Unethical behavior will be responded to by aggressively looking elsewhere for a different neofeudal lord in which I can sell them my blocks of time. There is nothing unethical in any of this. This is the system I am subject to. And I'm better off than many. Would I change it to be more respectful to humans? Absolutely. But in the end, I'm only 1 voice in 350m. And I can only do the rational thing for me and my family.
  - ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
    Um… You do realize that I wasn’t saying anything at all about yours (or anyone else’s) ethics, right?
    - noasaservice 5y ago
      That's not entirely true. You brought your ethics in the discussion. At a fair reading of that, was an implicit comparison of your ethics to others. Else, why would you bring it up?
      - ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
        See, that's the problem. I can't talk about my own ethics, without people assuming that I'm being "holier than thou." I'm not. I really, really am not. But I do get upset, when folks act as if it's not possible to live an ethical life, and thus, accuse me of lying. That's not nice.

ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago

Sadly, I can't argue with that. But I stayed at a company for 27 years, and never regretted it. This was because of the company, and what I got from the job (and also, what I didn't get). What I don't like, however, is people treating me with scorn, because of my loyalty, and personal ethics. I have lived a lifetime of the very highest Personal Integrity and Honor. It's not been easy, and I have definitely made many personal sacrifices, in order to stay true to my Principles. Anyone that has worked with me, is very much aware of my principles, and also my strong backbone. Being principled should, in no way, be mistaken for weakness, or lack of character. Just because the management are a bunch of dishonorable bastards, is no excuse -whatsoever- for becoming one, ourselves.

noasaservice 5y ago
In the end, employment is selling my time (which I cannot ever get back), for a pile of money. This pile of money, according to Marxian theory, is always less than the total value I bring. The owners keep the surplus, which is a massive amount above my pay. I will maximize my pile of money. You speak of ethics - and I will not engage in jobs which I believe are unethical. But it too is unethical to grossly underpay the people in your employ. But in corporations, ethics are downgraded to the minimum law in the jurisdiction. As for me, I am not a slave to a job. I show up and do work because there was an agreed-upon value for that work. The money buys my loyalty in the allotted blocks of time. No more, no less. When that agreement is no longer good, I renegotiate or look elsewhere. I am in an at-will state. They too can provide 0 notice to change the terms as well. Maybe in yesteryear, when long careers at a single company were common, that worked. I've heard the anecdotal Dickensian rags-to-riches stories of "Internal mail delivery guy becomes CEO". Those days, along with proper promotions, commensurate significant pay and benefit increases, and title are effectively gone. (I'm sure there's rare places that do that. Again, anecdotal and exceedingly rare.) My, my colleagues, and those around me MUST job-hop to get those raises and benefits. Not doing so is leaving massive piles of money to burn. And ethically speaking, making sure I assist in keeping my family in a good financial condition is of utmost ethics. Here in the US, the "social net" is abject from decades of hatred, ignorance, and utter lack of funding. The only social net I can count on is the one I create. As a white guy, there is no net if I fall. And there is no depth I stop at if in free-fall. I know that well. I see the homeless I used to live with when I go in town. And I'm intimately aware how easy my job can go poof and end up destitute. So yes, I see the landscape. I know the rules. And I will job-hop and will min-max my time and money. I create my own safety-net. I live significantly beneath my means to create a buffer. My loyalty is currently purchased in blocks of time 1/2 month long. Unethical behavior will be responded to by aggressively looking elsewhere for a different neofeudal lord in which I can sell them my blocks of time. There is nothing unethical in any of this. This is the system I am subject to. And I'm better off than many. Would I change it to be more respectful to humans? Absolutely. But in the end, I'm only 1 voice in 350m. And I can only do the rational thing for me and my family.
- ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
  Um… You do realize that I wasn’t saying anything at all about yours (or anyone else’s) ethics, right?
  - noasaservice 5y ago
    That's not entirely true. You brought your ethics in the discussion. At a fair reading of that, was an implicit comparison of your ethics to others. Else, why would you bring it up?
    - ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
      See, that's the problem. I can't talk about my own ethics, without people assuming that I'm being "holier than thou." I'm not. I really, really am not. But I do get upset, when folks act as if it's not possible to live an ethical life, and thus, accuse me of lying. That's not nice.