5 ms·

The Texas Instruments MSP430 is another good one to look at. At one point, dev kits were available for under $10. It's a good choice for low-power applications

The Texas Instruments MSP430 is another good one to look at. At one point, dev kits were available for under $10. It's a good choice for low-power applications. Comes with a free IDE.

sgt 5y ago
I have a few MSP430's, mostly the really lower end ones and I have recently been wondering if it's really worth it for a hobbyist. The ESP's have low power modes as well, and can run off a tiny battery, which was the primary strength of MSP. Any thoughts? I like the MSP ecosystem and docs, but ESP also shines there.
- lpmay 5y ago
  It's up to hobbyists what's worth it to them, but the power consumption of the ESP 8266/32 is not _really_ comparable to the '430. "Deep sleep" mode on the ESP seems to be about 20uA, an MSP430FR5969 can go to a 20nA LPM 4.5 mode (factor of 1000 lower). Harder to compare in a HN comment, but active mode power consumption is also in the MSP's favor for many applications particularly when using the built in hardware accelerators like LEA. Of course the MSP430 doesn't have a WiFi modem or a giant hobbyist community like the ESP, so I'm really not trying to make an argument for which is "better" just trying to add some contrast to the low power features you asked about.
  - sgt 5y ago
    Good point... my perception on power usage was absolutely wrong. MSP's are aging a bit though. At least the ones in my drawer. Is the hw platform being actively developed or has it plateau'd?
    - lpmay 5y ago
      I think the platform is very much still alive and kicking. It is still the only uP platform I am aware of which is available with embedded FRAM which is low power, non volatile, extremely more write durable than flash and rad hard. Again, maybe not top selling features for a hobbyist project but absolutely compelling for certain industrial use cases.
      - sgt 5y ago
        Thanks - you got me excited about MSP430 again. I am wondering if I should build an AC motor controller for fun, since I happen to have an AC motor on my bench.
        lpmay 5y ago
        No problem! You are not the first person I've heard express the impression that the MSP430 is slipping into irrelevance, and while I agree the places it shines may be getting squeezed by low power ARM parts I think they can be pretty compelling for applications where they are a good fit. They are simple, yet modern enough to support full featured c compilers, have a history of focusing on low power and the FRAM is a pretty solid differentiator if your use case can take advantage of it. Jay's article here can't really show any of that off because the one dollar price point is below the sweet spot where most of the nice features kick in
auxym 5y ago
TBH the rpi pico (rp2040 dev board) is hard to beat for the price of 5$. Dual core ARM cortex-m0+ at 100 something MHz and loads of ram and flash.
- makapuf 5y ago
  Dont forget programmable io ports with their independent tiny cores.
  - auxym 5y ago
    Oh yes, the PIO is very cool and somewhat unique. The list of examples of things that can be implemented with such a tiny "computer" (9 instructions assembly language, program size maximum of 32 instructions) is quite impressive: https://github.com/raspberrypi/pico-examples/tree/master/pio https://github.com/raspberrypi/pico-examples/tree/master/pio In fact, the rp2040 examples and SDK docs are very, very good compared to most traditional manufacturer's documentation and by itself makes it a very good value proposition for hobbyists.
GeorgeTirebiter 5y ago
I have been struggling to get TI's (free) Code Composer Studio to recognize my MSP430FR2311 boards now on-and-off for months. They 'upgrade' the code, and then I can't program my devices. In fact, so far, I've spent more time trying to get the dev environment to work than developing my code. Not Fun. Very cool when it does work, tho. I'd prefer to pay a little more for parts and get some English-based support. I'll work through the Code Disposer Studio issues...again...
- GeorgeTirebiter 5y ago
  It helps if the USB cable one is using actually provides more than just Power and Ground. (red-faced blushing....) I take back all the mud about CCS; except of course now it wants to put a new bootloader on one of the boards, but seems unable to do that. Good thing the other board is fine.
  - rramadass 5y ago
    >It helps if the USB cable one is using actually provides more than just Power and Ground. (red-faced blushing....) Ha, ha, ha. We have all been there. Have you tried the Energia IDE? - https://energia.nu/ https://energia.nu/
    - GeorgeTirebiter 5y ago
      Wow, didn't know about that. Interesting! thanks. The MSP430 branch is meant for low power; and or getting you and interface translation without needed an FPGA. They are cool -- sort of like pdp-11 in philosophy.

The Texas Instruments MSP430 is another good one to look at. At one point, dev kits were available for under $10. It's a good choice for low-power applications. Comes with a free IDE.

sgt 5y ago

I have a few MSP430's, mostly the really lower end ones and I have recently been wondering if it's really worth it for a hobbyist. The ESP's have low power modes as well, and can run off a tiny battery, which was the primary strength of MSP. Any thoughts? I like the MSP ecosystem and docs, but ESP also shines there.

lpmay 5y ago
It's up to hobbyists what's worth it to them, but the power consumption of the ESP 8266/32 is not _really_ comparable to the '430. "Deep sleep" mode on the ESP seems to be about 20uA, an MSP430FR5969 can go to a 20nA LPM 4.5 mode (factor of 1000 lower). Harder to compare in a HN comment, but active mode power consumption is also in the MSP's favor for many applications particularly when using the built in hardware accelerators like LEA. Of course the MSP430 doesn't have a WiFi modem or a giant hobbyist community like the ESP, so I'm really not trying to make an argument for which is "better" just trying to add some contrast to the low power features you asked about.
- sgt 5y ago
  Good point... my perception on power usage was absolutely wrong. MSP's are aging a bit though. At least the ones in my drawer. Is the hw platform being actively developed or has it plateau'd?
  - lpmay 5y ago
    I think the platform is very much still alive and kicking. It is still the only uP platform I am aware of which is available with embedded FRAM which is low power, non volatile, extremely more write durable than flash and rad hard. Again, maybe not top selling features for a hobbyist project but absolutely compelling for certain industrial use cases.
    - sgt 5y ago
      Thanks - you got me excited about MSP430 again. I am wondering if I should build an AC motor controller for fun, since I happen to have an AC motor on my bench.
      - lpmay 5y ago
        No problem! You are not the first person I've heard express the impression that the MSP430 is slipping into irrelevance, and while I agree the places it shines may be getting squeezed by low power ARM parts I think they can be pretty compelling for applications where they are a good fit. They are simple, yet modern enough to support full featured c compilers, have a history of focusing on low power and the FRAM is a pretty solid differentiator if your use case can take advantage of it. Jay's article here can't really show any of that off because the one dollar price point is below the sweet spot where most of the nice features kick in

auxym 5y ago

TBH the rpi pico (rp2040 dev board) is hard to beat for the price of 5$. Dual core ARM cortex-m0+ at 100 something MHz and loads of ram and flash.

makapuf 5y ago
Dont forget programmable io ports with their independent tiny cores.
- auxym 5y ago
  Oh yes, the PIO is very cool and somewhat unique. The list of examples of things that can be implemented with such a tiny "computer" (9 instructions assembly language, program size maximum of 32 instructions) is quite impressive: https://github.com/raspberrypi/pico-examples/tree/master/pio https://github.com/raspberrypi/pico-examples/tree/master/pio In fact, the rp2040 examples and SDK docs are very, very good compared to most traditional manufacturer's documentation and by itself makes it a very good value proposition for hobbyists.

GeorgeTirebiter 5y ago

I have been struggling to get TI's (free) Code Composer Studio to recognize my MSP430FR2311 boards now on-and-off for months. They 'upgrade' the code, and then I can't program my devices. In fact, so far, I've spent more time trying to get the dev environment to work than developing my code. Not Fun. Very cool when it does work, tho. I'd prefer to pay a little more for parts and get some English-based support. I'll work through the Code Disposer Studio issues...again...

GeorgeTirebiter 5y ago
It helps if the USB cable one is using actually provides more than just Power and Ground. (red-faced blushing....) I take back all the mud about CCS; except of course now it wants to put a new bootloader on one of the boards, but seems unable to do that. Good thing the other board is fine.
- rramadass 5y ago
  >It helps if the USB cable one is using actually provides more than just Power and Ground. (red-faced blushing....) Ha, ha, ha. We have all been there. Have you tried the Energia IDE? - https://energia.nu/ https://energia.nu/
  - GeorgeTirebiter 5y ago
    Wow, didn't know about that. Interesting! thanks. The MSP430 branch is meant for low power; and or getting you and interface translation without needed an FPGA. They are cool -- sort of like pdp-11 in philosophy.