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And paypal this morning too [1] It does feel coordinated. I know corporate law is kind of irrelevant in a context of war, but it feels more than ever like a ca

by cm2187 5y ago

And paypal this morning too [1] It does feel coordinated. I know corporate law is kind of irrelevant in a context of war, but it feels more than ever like a cartel. [1] https://www.reuters.com/business/paypal-shuts-down-its-services-russia-citing-ukraine-aggression-2022-03-05/ https://www.reuters.com/business/paypal-shuts-down-its-servi...

mda 5y ago
Maybe they just have common sense.
alkonaut 5y ago
In this context when one actor pulls out, the eyes turn on the others who either pull out or will have to accept being seen as supporting the regime. The coordination doesn’t have to exist for it to look coordinated. No one wants to be seen as late to leave.
- dahdum 5y ago
  It also takes time to interpret how the sanctions affect an industry and what actions need to be taken, and those interpretations are going to be pretty correlated.
- gremlinsinc 5y ago
  Plus the longer you stay, the more the value of ruble, and exchange rates drops and stocks/etc of those affiliated w/ the sinking ship that is Russia, the more likely you are to be holding the 'hot potato' and lose the most money when everything drops....in other words better to get going while the going is good.
- thaumasiotes 5y ago
  I remember reading an analysis of (I believe) WWI that said that by that point, the rulers of Europe had successfully completed the hard work of discouraging war among themselves through a long-term project of intermarriage. They were all related to each other and therefore mostly uninterested in going to war against each other.[1] But at some point popular demand for war started to rise and the noble houses weren't able to stop it. We're seeing something similar here. [1] This can't be the whole story; European history is replete with brother-brother and father-son wars. But I think the idea is worth considering anyway.
youngNed 5y ago
> It does feel coordinated This whole thread has been an eye opener for me, I had no idea so many people had so little idea of what 'economic sanctions' means. Yes, yes it does feel coordinated. Have you noticed it came after sanctions were announced as well??
- cm2187 5y ago
  Thanks for implying I don't know what an economic sanction is. I do not believe this is part of the economic sanctions announced by gvts. This is a private initiative.
  - youngNed 5y ago
    Apologies for any confusion, I wasn't implying, I was *stating* that you have no idea what economic sanctions are. "As a result of sanction orders, we have blocked multiple financial institutions from the Mastercard payment network. We will continue to work with regulators in the days ahead to abide fully by our compliance obligations as they evolve." Source: https://www.mastercard.com/news/press/2022/february/mastercard-statement/ https://www.mastercard.com/news/press/2022/february/masterca...
    - cm2187 5y ago
      Ceasing operations with a certain number of banks that were individually sanctioned != ceasing operations in the whole country.
  - 323 5y ago
    An article from yesterday regarding SWIFT explained this. The western govs issued a "commander's intent" to sanction Russia. That's basically a direction that every financial entity which does transactions with Russia must assume that they too should suspend operations, unless explicitly cleared otherwise. Russia was declared "untouchable", unless you have explicit permission to touch it (like energy markets). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intent_(military) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intent_(military)
wrycoder 5y ago
Nothing new here. The large tech and financial corporations have moved in lockstep for a long time, and the rest of the Fortune 500 isn't far behind. The average person and small business is rapidly losing the right to transact.
tablespoon 5y ago
> It does feel coordinated. I know corporate law is kind of irrelevant in a context of war, but it feels more than ever like a cartel. You don't need a cartel to coordinate. If someone shoots a gun and everyone ducks, their ducking was coordinated by the gunshot. They didn't need to get together and have a discussion to all duck together at the same time.

by cm2187 5y ago

mda 5y ago

Maybe they just have common sense.

alkonaut 5y ago

In this context when one actor pulls out, the eyes turn on the others who either pull out or will have to accept being seen as supporting the regime. The coordination doesn’t have to exist for it to look coordinated. No one wants to be seen as late to leave.

dahdum 5y ago
It also takes time to interpret how the sanctions affect an industry and what actions need to be taken, and those interpretations are going to be pretty correlated.
gremlinsinc 5y ago
Plus the longer you stay, the more the value of ruble, and exchange rates drops and stocks/etc of those affiliated w/ the sinking ship that is Russia, the more likely you are to be holding the 'hot potato' and lose the most money when everything drops....in other words better to get going while the going is good.
thaumasiotes 5y ago
I remember reading an analysis of (I believe) WWI that said that by that point, the rulers of Europe had successfully completed the hard work of discouraging war among themselves through a long-term project of intermarriage. They were all related to each other and therefore mostly uninterested in going to war against each other.[1] But at some point popular demand for war started to rise and the noble houses weren't able to stop it. We're seeing something similar here. [1] This can't be the whole story; European history is replete with brother-brother and father-son wars. But I think the idea is worth considering anyway.

youngNed 5y ago

> It does feel coordinated This whole thread has been an eye opener for me, I had no idea so many people had so little idea of what 'economic sanctions' means. Yes, yes it does feel coordinated. Have you noticed it came after sanctions were announced as well??

cm2187 5y ago
Thanks for implying I don't know what an economic sanction is. I do not believe this is part of the economic sanctions announced by gvts. This is a private initiative.
- youngNed 5y ago
  Apologies for any confusion, I wasn't implying, I was *stating* that you have no idea what economic sanctions are. "As a result of sanction orders, we have blocked multiple financial institutions from the Mastercard payment network. We will continue to work with regulators in the days ahead to abide fully by our compliance obligations as they evolve." Source: https://www.mastercard.com/news/press/2022/february/mastercard-statement/ https://www.mastercard.com/news/press/2022/february/masterca...
  - cm2187 5y ago
    Ceasing operations with a certain number of banks that were individually sanctioned != ceasing operations in the whole country.
- 323 5y ago
  An article from yesterday regarding SWIFT explained this. The western govs issued a "commander's intent" to sanction Russia. That's basically a direction that every financial entity which does transactions with Russia must assume that they too should suspend operations, unless explicitly cleared otherwise. Russia was declared "untouchable", unless you have explicit permission to touch it (like energy markets). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intent_(military) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intent_(military)

wrycoder 5y ago

Nothing new here. The large tech and financial corporations have moved in lockstep for a long time, and the rest of the Fortune 500 isn't far behind. The average person and small business is rapidly losing the right to transact.

tablespoon 5y ago

> It does feel coordinated. I know corporate law is kind of irrelevant in a context of war, but it feels more than ever like a cartel. You don't need a cartel to coordinate. If someone shoots a gun and everyone ducks, their ducking was coordinated by the gunshot. They didn't need to get together and have a discussion to all duck together at the same time.