5 ms·

Let’s be clear. The Russians being punished outside of Russia have blood on their hands. They should never have been allowed to buy property and football clubs

Let’s be clear. The Russians being punished outside of Russia have blood on their hands. They should never have been allowed to buy property and football clubs in the uk, because they weee gangster crooks who had stolen from their own country. That the uk govt was complicit in this at the time doesn’t make it wrong to act against them now. I have a lot more sympathy for the people hurt in Russsia now. Russians, whether they have been brainwashed into supporting Putin or not, are in for a bad time in the coming years.

skybrian 5y ago
This might be true, but they aren't being tried for their own crimes. It's just revenge.
- jacquesm 5y ago
  Clearly it is not revenge, that is a ridiculous thing to say. Sanctions are the kind of things that tend to send unmistakable messages: we are serious about this and we're willing to hurt our own interests to hurt yours, stop what you are doing or it will get worse. Of course that requires a modicum of rationality on the other side, which we may not have in this case, and obviously the rulers will usually be utterly unaffected. But six degrees works as well in Russia as it does elsewhere, and living under sanctions is a lot more comfortable than living under a rain of artillery fire. If you aim at the Russian industrial complex (which produces a lot of the arms), and the government with sanctions then obviously you will it the people too. But that's not as bad as a shooting war (or a nuclear war) would be. And it doesn't rule either out.
  - skybrian 5y ago
    UK Property and football clubs don't contribute to the Russian war effort, though. Yachts are not warships. Since trade with Russia has stopped, even selling them would make little difference. If anything we should be encouraging Russians to flee the country.
    - jacquesm 5y ago
      Those probably count for as much or more as the rest of the sanctions because they are the things the fat cats use to keep score.
      - skybrian 5y ago
        The "fat cats" don't seem to be in charge? Russia is turning into a totalitarian regime.
        jacquesm 5y ago
        > Russia is turning into a totalitarian regime. It has been for the last 20 years or so.

skybrian 5y ago

This might be true, but they aren't being tried for their own crimes. It's just revenge.

jacquesm 5y ago
Clearly it is not revenge, that is a ridiculous thing to say. Sanctions are the kind of things that tend to send unmistakable messages: we are serious about this and we're willing to hurt our own interests to hurt yours, stop what you are doing or it will get worse. Of course that requires a modicum of rationality on the other side, which we may not have in this case, and obviously the rulers will usually be utterly unaffected. But six degrees works as well in Russia as it does elsewhere, and living under sanctions is a lot more comfortable than living under a rain of artillery fire. If you aim at the Russian industrial complex (which produces a lot of the arms), and the government with sanctions then obviously you will it the people too. But that's not as bad as a shooting war (or a nuclear war) would be. And it doesn't rule either out.
- skybrian 5y ago
  UK Property and football clubs don't contribute to the Russian war effort, though. Yachts are not warships. Since trade with Russia has stopped, even selling them would make little difference. If anything we should be encouraging Russians to flee the country.
  - jacquesm 5y ago
    Those probably count for as much or more as the rest of the sanctions because they are the things the fat cats use to keep score.
    - skybrian 5y ago
      The "fat cats" don't seem to be in charge? Russia is turning into a totalitarian regime.
      - jacquesm 5y ago
        > Russia is turning into a totalitarian regime. It has been for the last 20 years or so.