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This is an interesting point. As more users get pigeonholed into sharing the same IPv4 addresses, IP-based rate limiting will essentially become useless. I wond

This is an interesting point. As more users get pigeonholed into sharing the same IPv4 addresses, IP-based rate limiting will essentially become useless. I wonder if this will help drive IPv6 adoption. > The biggest offenders are internet of things backends for registered devices I "own" and streaming services I'm paying for. Wait those are the services that are rate-limiting you? They're not smart enough to rate-limit based on your account credentials?

BeFlatXIII 5y ago
Now you’ve put it that way, I hope someone is a black hat accelerationist who deliberately makes a worm to turn all IPv4 addresses into spam IPs. Force v6 adoption by making the internet unusable for the laggards.
judge2020 5y ago
> I wonder if this will help drive IPv6 adoption. Only if users complain enough. Often they complain to the reverse proxy host[0] or website itself[1], when it would be a solved problem if IPv6 were properly deployed further. 0: top result on google for 'Cloudflare blocked me' with 38k views https://community.cloudflare.com/t/cloudflare-is-blocking-me-from-accessing-sites/12471?u=judge https://community.cloudflare.com/t/cloudflare-is-blocking-me... 1: https://www.coursera.support/s/question/0D51U00003BlYiVSAV/your-ip-address-is-currently-being-blocked-portugal?language=en_US https://www.coursera.support/s/question/0D51U00003BlYiVSAV/y...
sodality2 5y ago
> They're not smart enough to rate-limit based on your account credentials? This works until a VPN node starts having tens of thousands of users from one IP address.
- Lascaille 5y ago
  Rate limiting based on account credentials is a solution to having tons of users connecting from one IP address...
  - dgoldstein0 5y ago
    depends on what they are rate limiting. if they are trying to rate limit logins to prevent brute force attacks... I could see a naive implementation being problematic for NATed users.
wmf 5y ago
If IPv6 reputation is done at the /48 level but you have, say, a /56 then you're sharing reputation with up to 255 other customers.
- iforgotpassword 5y ago
  Even worse, there are ISP who hand out /64 which you shouldn't even do. I ran into this problem 15 years ago or so when I built my own ipv6 tunnel for home use using a hetzner server. Couldn't edit on Wikipedia, asked why, and apparently they blocked a whole /48 because of spam. Then they argued the whole provider should be blocked because it's a "tunnel provider" (it isn't) at which point I didn't even want to argue anymore and just stopped editing.
- fomine3 5y ago
  Still better situation than v4. Assigning is tend to be fixed and never shared.
- vikarti 5y ago
  /56? What about /64 per customer. ISP just ignores RIPE rules and explanations why /64 is not enough for complex home network.

BeFlatXIII 5y ago

Now you’ve put it that way, I hope someone is a black hat accelerationist who deliberately makes a worm to turn all IPv4 addresses into spam IPs. Force v6 adoption by making the internet unusable for the laggards.

judge2020 5y ago

> I wonder if this will help drive IPv6 adoption. Only if users complain enough. Often they complain to the reverse proxy host[0] or website itself[1], when it would be a solved problem if IPv6 were properly deployed further. 0: top result on google for 'Cloudflare blocked me' with 38k views https://community.cloudflare.com/t/cloudflare-is-blocking-me-from-accessing-sites/12471?u=judge https://community.cloudflare.com/t/cloudflare-is-blocking-me... 1: https://www.coursera.support/s/question/0D51U00003BlYiVSAV/your-ip-address-is-currently-being-blocked-portugal?language=en_US https://www.coursera.support/s/question/0D51U00003BlYiVSAV/y...

sodality2 5y ago

> They're not smart enough to rate-limit based on your account credentials? This works until a VPN node starts having tens of thousands of users from one IP address.

Lascaille 5y ago
Rate limiting based on account credentials is a solution to having tons of users connecting from one IP address...
- dgoldstein0 5y ago
  depends on what they are rate limiting. if they are trying to rate limit logins to prevent brute force attacks... I could see a naive implementation being problematic for NATed users.

wmf 5y ago

If IPv6 reputation is done at the /48 level but you have, say, a /56 then you're sharing reputation with up to 255 other customers.

iforgotpassword 5y ago
Even worse, there are ISP who hand out /64 which you shouldn't even do. I ran into this problem 15 years ago or so when I built my own ipv6 tunnel for home use using a hetzner server. Couldn't edit on Wikipedia, asked why, and apparently they blocked a whole /48 because of spam. Then they argued the whole provider should be blocked because it's a "tunnel provider" (it isn't) at which point I didn't even want to argue anymore and just stopped editing.
fomine3 5y ago
Still better situation than v4. Assigning is tend to be fixed and never shared.
vikarti 5y ago
/56? What about /64 per customer. ISP just ignores RIPE rules and explanations why /64 is not enough for complex home network.